Piracy Sadly Hits the Virtual Console

[wraggster]

IT had to happen didnt it and the after effects will really harm all the good work done by the homebrew community, the cracking of the Virtual Console means that Nintendo will go after holes and exploits until we are left with nothing, anyway heres what one of the Wii scenes finest (http://hackmii.com/2008/04/thanks-waninkoko/)says about this sad news:


I’ve ranted a bit about how we need to be responsible as coders and consider the effects that releasing software will have on the community — in terms of hardware damage. I didn’t think that I had to also point out the need to consider broader, longer-term effects.

Several people have send me links to a recent release — the first pirated VC game. No, I’m not posting any links, and please don’t post any in comments — it’s easy enough to find anyway, if you really care. It’s currently the raw decrypted files, and not yet in a form suitable to be installed on a Wii, but I give that another 24 hours.

This is a direct result of Waninkoko’s release of his NAND FS Dumper. This is not the same as his “NAND Dumper” that he released a few days ago, which dumped the raw, encrypted contents of NAND to an SD card. (That’s pretty easy to do — just do some reads from /dev/flash — and is based on like 6 lines of code that I gave him. It’s also mostly harmless.)

No, this uses a exploit in the NAND FS permission system on the Wii that lets it read all of the contents of all titles on the Wii — including decrypted VC games and anything else.

For what it’s worth, this is the reason we never released any tools or code after the 24c3 hack. Segher asked that we not, in the fear that this moment would come. So, we didn’t, and sure enough it happened anyway, although it took perhaps four months longer than it would have. There is only so much we can do.

Anyway, Waninkoko’s code is almost exactly the same as some code that dhewg released months ago — the Wiifuse server. What’s the difference? Dhewg didn’t want to enable this, so he left it to the end user to provide the authentication credentials that Wiifuse uses to read the contents of the NAND. Waninkoko’s program does the same thing, but it comes with a hacked TMD that enables “root access” (more or less).

Why is this a problem? Remember what happened when Datel released their Freeloader?

Piracy is morally wrong — developers need to eat, too. However, I don’t expect this to persuade everyone, so I will also offer a more pragmatic reason. Nintendo’s primary motive in patching security holes is strictly financial — in the same way that releasing firmware patches is dangerous for us because it requires careful testing, releasing firmware patches is expensive for Nintendo because it requires careful testing on their part, too. Consequently, they will not bother to fix bugs until they cause specific, identifiable monetary loss on their part.

We saw this with IOS37, which I believe was a reaction to Datel’s Freeloader. However, Nintendo has never bothered to activate IOS37 — why? I think it’s because they were specifically trying to prevent / discourage Datel from pressing discs for US and Japanese Wiis. All of the PAL discs have already been made, and Datel has already spent all of the money they need to spend to sell those discs. At this point, they will continue to sell the discs they made because they have nothing to lose by doing so — and when IOS37 comes, they will try to deal with it however they can.

On the other hand, they have not yet spent the money to make USA and NTSC/J discs. They now know there is a very real possibility their current software will stop working on updated Wiis at some future date, so they now have to sit and wait for that “shoe to drop” before proceeding. Nintendo released IOS37 to stall Datel.

Now, Nintendo needs to keep people from copying VC games. So what will they do? They have to patch all of the things that could enable this. So, they will now go ahead and patch all of the old versions of IOS, and they will probably go ahead and patch BOOT2.

I know that Waninkoko is not a bad guy — he and I have chatted a fair bit on IRC — but I think he is reckless and does not think through the consequences of his actions.

Oh, and another thing — people keep asking me “Will there be some way to downgrade our consoles once IOS37 has been released?” I hate that question. Why?

The answer will always be “Probably, but it will require finding a security hole which Nintendo hasn’t patched.” That’s why I don’t like to answer the question — because if I start talking about all of the security holes that could be used to downgrade a Wii, then they will get patched before we have a chance to use them.

Guess what? The hole that Waninkoko is using to read VC games out of the NAND FS is the same hole that I was planning on using (first) to be able to downgrade versions of IOS. So, when it takes another few months to be able to downgrade a Wii, you can say “Thanks, Waninkoko!”

Give your verdicts via comments

[Mr.Guy]

There is a point where someone needs to draw the line. And this is VERY VERY close to that point.

[supersoni88]

D:

[idapimp]

damn. its completely wrong to release software like this. I've been waiting for new stuff in the homebrew scene but not stuff like this. i know it would have happened one way or the other eventually because we all know the world is filled with assholes. so if one jerk off didn't release it then another jerk off would have. however i do think that it definitely could have waited. thanks waninkoko!

[hksrb25s14]

man, this is killing the wii. soon as you know it, barely any new games will hit the system.

[wiggy fuzz]

this is just too far...

[royvedas]

Woohoo! More Piracy! Always super-duper-cool.

Come on, everybody

"Yarh, Yarh - shiver me timbers"

[R4mbo]

I just have seen the video, Never heared that he released software... and the video wasnt really a proof that the games has REALLY been ripped from VC...

[linkinworm]

is there really any point in it? i cant really see everyone uploading games they have paid for, because there kinda expencive the VC, there are emulators that work fine, this is stupid, everyone will download like 100 game package off torrent but it wont fit on the wii

[h2923j42n2]

With the emulators that have been getting released, I just don't see the point in doing this. The emulators have the potential to have more abilities than the Virtual Console games (online play, customizable controls, use of Wii remote, Nunchuk, and Classic Controller, etc.). I am not condoning this, but the only way this could potentially be at all useful, from a Virtual Console standpoint, would be for the N64. I believe, with time, we will see a full-speed N64 emulator. As of right now, from my understanding, you need a certain tool to compile the files, but eventually, this will probably already be done, where people only have to download the file, and install it by either using a disc, or the Twilight Hack. This could lead to Nintendo attempting to patch (if possible) the Twilight Hack, especially if the same method for copying Virtual Console games could also be used on WiiWare titles and channels.

[Unicron2k]

Sure enough, Piracy is a big thing in europe, because a new game lies on about 100 to 110 USD, and i have resorted to piracy a few times because of REALLY slow/late european releases(note: NEVER a console game, only PC games), but to pirate something like this i bound to make Nintendo take action, and patch up the security holes. So far, all the security holes i can remember, is based on the Twillight hack.

Let's hope waninkoko doesn't develop this any further.
And Big N: why not unlock your console to allow the community to develop to?(I know your'e watching us!)

[Mr.Guy]

Well I can and cant blame europe for most of the crap support and terrible rate of games being released from Nintendo, Sony, ect...

[idapimp]

more people know about torrents than they do emulators and console hacking. this hurts nintendo more by opening the piracy to a broader audience. fortunately i dont have much guilt either way because i own most the games i emulate. i just dont like blowing in cartridges anymore. and unfortunately nintendo will not unlock the console and endorse community developement because not only is it a financial threat, but it also opens the entire spectrum of people who play wii and who have internet who arent the brightest and want to try homebrew to bricking their wii by downloading malicious code. if nintendo endorses the homebrew on the console then idiots will try to hold nintendo responsible for damages.

[vicious1988]

I experimented with the VC files before the Twilight Hack came along. The furthest I ever got was downloading the unpatched data (no Wii auth key).

Its sucks that this was discovered and subsequently released. VC isn't something I feared as much as executing ISO files, but that won't be far behind. I hope Nintendo can find a way to patch it without disrupting real homebrew development.

[Mr.Guy]

I hate to say this but can someone link me a download link? I like to screw around with the source a little.

[DimensionT]

I hate to say this but can someone link me a download link? I like to screw around with the source a little.

Yeah, that's why you want it. Of course...

The article says that Nintendo will probably fix this by updating the old IOS? That's ****ing great. When I heard about this before, I was thinking they'd just update the security in the downloadable crap... But updating the old IOS will break the Twilight hack, no? Maybe it's just homebrew channels I'm thinking of that use the IOS.

Seriously, I knew this would happen, and I knew what Nintendo would do in the long run. How the hell could I know this and not "Waninkoko"? He probably knew, and just didn't give a shit if you ask me.

Completely pointless.

[splodger15]

I knew it would come one day thats what half of the pirates who owned a Wii wanted the VC and the Wii hacked

[Mr.Guy]

Yeah, that's why you want it. Of course...

The article says that Nintendo will probably fix this by updating the old IOS? That's ****ing great. When I heard about this before, I was thinking they'd just update the security in the downloadable crap... But updating the old IOS will break the Twilight hack, no? Maybe it's just homebrew channels I'm thinking of that use the IOS.

Seriously, I knew this would happen, and I knew what Nintendo would do in the long run. How the hell could I know this and not "Waninkoko"? He probably knew, and just didn't give a shit if you ask me.

Completely pointless.

NO! Really thats all want to do with this. I mean the Big N is going to probably fix it so I want to get my 2 cent in on this before its terminated. I never have and never will pirate things like Wii games and VC games
(unless you count emulation). It's pretty worthless anyways because of the emulators. I'm against this just as much as you! I simple want to...I dunno mess with the source a little. I really really hope this get fixed and quick! I support Nintendo :thumbup:

[Echizen]

I own a wii but I haven't bought any VC titles yet.
I'm very interested to buy a collection of VC titles in the future.
If I have to buy me a new wii someday and bought many titles so far, do I have to pay for all titles again?

[Mr.Guy]

I own a wii but I haven't bought any VC titles yet.
I'm very interested to buy a collection of VC titles in the future.
If I have to buy me a new wii someday and bought many titles so far, do I have to pay for all titles again?

Yes but you really shouldn't have to buy a new Wii, meaning you shouldn't use up all of the space that N gives you but it happens. If you do fill up the Wii with VC games then you should probably resort to emulators via the Twilight Hack. Heck you should probably use it now. But still buy a few VC games here and there, that way it still helps the Big N.

[paul3100]

I for one think its great the VC has been hacked , i payed for loads of games as a child/adult for these older consoles and will be damned if i am paying again for the same game!

Ok so the games don't cost as much as they did back in the day but they are still quite expensive for old games which have already made there owners money.

S***W nintendo, if i owned a wii i would download everything i could for free, besides im always skint so wouldn't make any difference to nintendo or any other games company :-)

Flame me all you want but i just don't care, i sleep well at night lol

paul

[Mr.Guy]

Fail.

[strigoi]

This is a total suck.....
and I don't even have an interest in VC. I USE the old consoles these games were originally on!!

The only thing I could use was Freeloader for GC Action Replay and play GBA on Wii with the Datel "player".

Did Mr. 3100 have to pawn off his old systems that he "thinks it's great?"

Whatever, my Parkinson's just kicked in again....

[Mr.Guy]

You have Parkinson's?! Oh man that sucks I feel real bad for you.

[____anders____]

we're screwed! shit i'm not going to update anymore..

why do that guy just ruin it all for us, that piece of shit, send him down here and he will never see the light of the day again!
soon we won't even be able to play homemade games, we have barely started to play them and then a guy comes along and throw a stick in our wheel.
idiot!

soon we will have to do it all over again, i'm pretty sure that there will be no exploits after N have fixed those who already exist, so no homebrew without modchip in the future, heck maybe the modchips will stop working after the update too!

WHY??

[PeyeRate420]

well bro you kinda took the words outa my mouth...about the modchips being bloacked but THE ONLY LOSS WOULD BE WIIWARE TITLES BEING CRACKED FORGET THE VC ITS BEEN IN DANGER SINCE THE FIRST EMULATOR RELEASE!

I MEAN WITH ALL THE EMULATORS OUT THAT ALONE EFFECTS VC SALES...

so to put the BLAME ON Waninkoko is comeplete BULL SH!TE because with all the emulators TEHSKEEN is releasing YOU CAN GO THANK THEM FOR THE PATCH TOO
the FACT is this:
THERE ARE CURRENTLY MORE GAMES AVAILABLE for homebrew than there is to PURCHASE ON VC....

DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT BARES NO FINANCIAL EFFECT! "so no i wont be bashing wananako for being smart enough to get a head start on something that remains completly enevidable in the first place....

NINTENDO WILL PATCH OUR EXPLOITS YOU KNEW THAT FROM THE BEGINNING.....BE IT VC ROMSD OR EMULATION ROMS

ANY EXCUSE WOULD DO....I DONT SEE YOU ATTACKING EMULATOR CODERS FROM TEH SKEEN DO YOU?

so when i say “Thanks, Waninkoko!" I MEAN IT! THANK YOU FOR REALIZING EMULATION IS EMULATION AND THAT IT ALL BARES A FINANCIAL EFFECT ON NINTENDO SO....PATCHES WERE BOUND TO OCCOUR WITHOUT BEING ASSHOLES AND FLAMING WANINKOKO :(

[hicaow]

Nintendo DS Lite Black with R4 Revolution, Nintendo WII with D2Ckey on WII-Clip and Sandisk Sansa E250 with RockBox Firmware

i don't understand where this moral high ground is coming from .. all of sudden everyone is anti piracy , i mean take this guy in the post above me , you have a D2CKey which has nothing to do with homebrew , so you what , look at it ? .. you have an R4 , lemme guess you own all the roms on it .. even this site and others , you have no problem posting that article about PSN games being hacked but oh noes some 20 year old game on the VC is way to far .. you all have emulators with 1000's of PIRATED games but oh noes not the VC!! ..

[Gunnex]

I posted this on my FA page earlier.


Today, a respected member of the Wii Homebrew Scene did something terrible. He successfully decrypted the Virtual Console encryption. This and Datel's Freeloader are leading to the emminent IOS37.

IOS37 is a Wii patch that is currently just sitting idle, but it will be released in a future update. The installation of an active IOS37 will disable all loopholes, homebrew channels, and many other things that make the Scene so strong to the point where only the Twilight Hack will work. I've been planning on joining the Scene later this month when I finally get the Twilight Hack running on my console, but recent events are leading me in the directions of not joining or being a silent member in which all my releases will be private or for my own use only.

The only way I could condone VC decryption would be for the study of how the Wii emulates complex systems such as the N64 and other functions such as the Picture import function in Pokemon Snap. Yet, that is not the point of this disaster. This disaster is for piracy, which Nintendo claims to be the focus of the homebrew Scene, which is far from the truth.

I would like you all who have a Wii console to not participate in any piracy whatsoever in order to prove a point, that we all should be respectful of the Scene and Nintendo's anti-piracy standards, and maybe we could create a better image for homebrew developers.

I don't expect everyone to do it, but we would be better off if we did.

[dejkirkby]

I find a lot of you to be hypocritical.
You silently condone the loading of ISO's via wiikey and the like. You publicly condone the loading of rom's via emulators, yet when someone publicly admits to doing what a lot of Wii owners hope for in hacking the VC, you are up in arms because other people tell you to be.
Baa Baa.

[DimensionT]

I find a lot of you to be hypocritical.
You silently condone the loading of ISO's via wiikey and the like. You publicly condone the loading of rom's via emulators, yet when someone publicly admits to doing what a lot of Wii owners hope for in hacking the VC, you are up in arms because other people tell you to be.
Baa Baa.

Everyone's pissed of because it makes no sense. It's seriously going to make Nintendo angry, and for what? Nothing the VC does can't be done with homebrew. All this matters to are the are the impatient noobs that want fullspeed N64, RIGHT NOW!!!

[paul3100]

I find a lot of you to be hypocritical.
You silently condone the loading of ISO's via wiikey and the like. You publicly condone the loading of rom's via emulators, yet when someone publicly admits to doing what a lot of Wii owners hope for in hacking the VC, you are up in arms because other people tell you to be.
Baa Baa.

Couldn't agree more actually , i do see everyones point thinking this may bring patches to the wii but it would have happened eitherway sooner or later.

paul

[Mr.Guy]

ROM are good!
Hacked VC is... wait why is this here?!

[idapimp]

like i said earlier, i am up in arms and mad about this not because i was told to be, but because this will definitely piss of nintendo. there are FAR more people using VC than emulators. this will go mainstream. you know that there will be youtube videos. then stupid kids do research and figure out how to do it and then there goes a large sum of nintendo's profits. they will lose far more money from this rather than form some of us using emulators.

[JKKDARK]

Damn, it's terrible news. I hope it will not be popular, but that's impossible :(

[halfway2hell]

There is a point where someone needs to draw the line. And this is VERY VERY close to that point.

i think nintendo sony and ms have went over the line like for example contra like I own the nes version the real cartridge WOW!!!! ok i paid for this a long time ago why the **** do I have to pay for it again for the 360 the wii and if sony is offering it them as well. We are getting charged money to play games that we already own. Like WTF? instead of buying the games are gamers going to have to buy the rights to a game so they wont get constantly charged over and over and over again like ****man for the same game that you probably owned physically. I say cheers to the ppl who hack this garbage, and a big **** you to the companies that rather sell you old games that you own instead of making some descent titles for their freakin console. These companies deserve this :D

[Shadowblind]

I think Nintendo was pulling bull**** when they made the VC in general, charging so much money for crappy games that you can pick up for 50 cents. However, even that doesn't excuse piracy.

[DimensionT]

i think nintendo sony and ms have went over the line like for example contra like I own the nes version the real cartridge WOW!!!! ok i paid for this a long time ago why the F/U/C/K do I have to pay for it again for the 360 the wii and if sony is offering it them as well. We are getting charged money to play games that we already own. Like WTF? instead of buying the games are gamers going to have to buy the rights to a game so they wont get constantly charged over and over and over again like F/U/C/K/ man for the same game that you probably owned physically. I say cheers to the ppl who hack this garbage, and a big f/u/c/k/ you to the companies that rather sell you old games that you own instead of making some descent titles for their freakin console. These companies deserve this :D

Then go boot up an emulator. They may still not like it, but it's far less likely the make them angry then VC being cracked. VC being cracked means WiiWare being cracked, and that means big business.

[JKKDARK]

I think Nintendo was pulling bull**** when they made the VC in general, charging so much money for crappy games that you can pick up for 50 cents. However, even that doesn't excuse piracy.

only 50 cents?

Chrono Trigger? Final Fantasy? Phantasy Star? Legend of Zelda?

[Shadowblind]

only 50 cents?

Chrono Trigger? Final Fantasy? Phantasy Star? Legend of Zelda?

Aye. I found most of those in garage sales for about that much, less then a dollar. LOZ costing $10 is simply painful unless you have never played it. Everything else is just painful. Still, some of the games (N64) are great, but overpriced.

[vicious1988]

*snickers at the amount of posts trying to oust hypocrites*

I haven't seen much in the way of hypocritical posts. Everyone is stating that cracking the VC is bad. Not because you are getting the games for free, but because it could lead to Nintendo patching the Twilight Hack. Meaning no more homebrew development.

That means Wii HB devs will be in the same boat as everyone who owns a PS3 or 360, waiting for a good modchip to come along that allows homebrew. Which also means we'll be stuck with using inefficient disks instead of SD Cards to load our shit until a loader comes along. Either that or create a dev team to get a devkit for a couple grand.

[Brainy142]

uh, sigh... Why whould you do this (their emulators SUCK)
man it just plain wrong/ stupid

[Mr.Guy]

uh, sigh... Why whould you do this (their emulators SUCK)
man it just plain wrong/ stupid

Wtf are you talking about?! Nintendo emulators are spot on! Or are you saying that the emulator that we have suck?

[JKKDARK]

uh, sigh... Why whould you do this (their emulators SUCK)
man it just plain wrong/ stupid

How can they suck if they are developed by the own companies?

[PeyeRate420]

lol nintendo's are just fine for performance but a reason they suck? how about the fact EVERY ROM has a EMULATORS SOFTWARE attached to it :( why does that suck you say? well because it means if you buy 12 n64 roms you also have to take 12 SEPERATE emulators into account ...WHY does that matter? because you dont have a lot of onboard memory or room for roms (while they can be STORED on a SD they cannot be PLAYED FROM SAID SD) :( as far as it getting cracked i think that it was bound to happen and pointing the finger at waninkoko wont really do a lot now :( but im just hoping that wiiware isnt effected :P but we kinda knew that it would get patched one way or another nintendo wouldnt have just ignored the twilight hack because as posted above a little research and your booting emulators with the twilight hack from a front SD in no time ;) i think its funny how you defend emulators but condem the VC all over nintendo reaction

"they need little financial reasons to secure there system EVEN WITHOUT VC being hacked IT WOULD BE ADDRESSED
i mean look at free loader ;) and the action replay exploit and sd loader all being noticed by ninty security ;) but we had no prob with waninkoko releasing the nandumper app LOL or BOOSTER releasing devhook or DA releasing a new custom firmeware....so i think he was right to say there is some hypocritical response to this...IF YOU USE A NON LICENSED SOFTWARE your STILL NOT ON NINTENDO's "good side" please beleave! rofl ...

[dudeofcube]

All i can say is, the TP hack better not get patched in the next few months because of this. That would put us back at square zero. All i ever wanted from the wii-scene was a usable linux distro, like xbox-linux....... Looks like now, that might not be happening.

I could care less about the emulators for wii, just give me the homebrew games, like wii-tetris, ballion, etc...

I have a very sad, deep feeling, that nintendo will destroy the wii-scene as we know it.

GOD THIS SUCKS:mad::mad:

[idapimp]

i am a believer that the VC is a good thing due to the fact that it gets younger gamers to open up to the concept of classic games and the fact that state of the art graphics don't make the game. however i just hope that the US release of mario kart wont require an update/hack patch to play it. if it doesnt then i will be fine. i just wont update my wii until a work around is found.

[turtleman6431]

only 50 cents?

Chrono Trigger? Final Fantasy? Phantasy Star? Legend of Zelda?And Earthbound, possibly one of the most expensive SNES games I've ever bought (more expesnive then chorno and FF). Can't forget the Earthbound...

[1NOOB]

hmmmmm gbatemp post this -.-

______________________________________
Release Number VC001
Full Name Donkey Kong Country 2: Diddy's Kong Quest
Region Europe
Languages English
Release Group BlaZe
Size 02 x 15MB
Release Name Donkey.Kong.Country.2.Diddys.Kong.Quest.VC.PAL.Wii-BlaZe
Filename blz-dkc2p
Raw Dump
View NFO Click here
________________________________________


ps3news comment:


Unfortunately, since there are no public WAD packing tools, this is useless for the general public and will likely only lead to Nintendo patching security holes that may otherwise be useful for legitimate homebrew.

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

: \

[mr_nick666]

This is very bad news for the scene. I think Nintendos pricing has something to do with it though. In the UK an N64 game is £7 (apprx $14) which is an amazing rip-off. You could buy an actual console with a few games for little more than that! BUT! We had an alternative.. Homebrew! :D Now the actions of this fool may jepordise that :(



uh, sigh... Why whould you do this (their emulators SUCK)
man it just plain wrong/ stupid



Wtf are you talking about?! Nintendo emulators are spot on! Or are you saying that the emulator that we have suck?



How can they suck if they are developed by the own companies?

In Europe the emulators dont run too well compared to homebrew (playing through the GCube offered better emulation with more options). We had bars on the edges and choppy emulation :mad:

[paul3100]

Hey if the wii has such good emulators why don't we/ some hacker grab the source code to them and port to other systems including the Ds and pc :-) ?

But £7/$15 is a lot for an old game which is only yours as long as you own that console and even then as long as you have room for it on the wii memory!

paul

[____anders____]

i don't understand where this moral high ground is coming from .. all of sudden everyone is anti piracy , i mean take this guy in the post above me , you have a D2CKey which has nothing to do with homebrew , so you what , look at it ? .. you have an R4 , lemme guess you own all the roms on it .. even this site and others , you have no problem posting that article about PSN games being hacked but oh noes some 20 year old game on the VC is way to far .. you all have emulators with 1000's of PIRATED games but oh noes not the VC!! ..


well, i bought the d2ckey because i wanted to play Super Smash Bros Brawl, i don't see why you think that's wrong, i bought SSBB so don't flame me for that, but i also enjoy homebrew VERY much, and i don't want to stop playing it just because some idiot comes an releases a thing like that..

and the R4.. guess what, i really enjoy piracy too cus i haven't seen ANY DS game in my town, so thats the reason i bought it..

don't flame me, it's not me who released the sh!t.

think before you flame a guy you don't know what he's doing!
idiot..

[DPyro]

Meh, I just won't update my firmware. Not like too many interesting games will be released now. Also, whats stopping someone from creating a custom firmware?

[____anders____]

Meh, I just won't update my firmware. Not like too many interesting games will be released now. Also, whats stopping someone from creating a custom firmware?

i won't update either, i will read about the firmware update "changelog" somewhere on the internet though (probably here :))
a custom firmware would be cool though, but damn i would have butterflies when i should install it;)

my guess of a custom firmware would make use of the NAND dumper somehow, so we can edit the data and then flash it to the wii from SD card or DVD.
probably the same as the official firmware with added cooleness, like iso loader (it's bound to happen with a CFW) and built-in emulators and games and other cool stuff

[kingslime80]

Oh, come on now. You think the Big N hasn't taught of people creating Custom Firmware? You can probably kiss your on-line gameplay goodbye if that happens. You start ****ing around with their ability to make a buck off the VC and you slowly force them out of business. They have the most sought after console currently on the market, but that never kept a company from filing for Chapter 11. Personally, I will not even emulate games I can get on the VC due to that. They go under and where are the rest of us? Stuck with another advanced Gamecube. I'm not pretending to have any "Moral High Ground", but there's a point where you have to stop, and ripping the company off directly is where I draw the line. Sure, custom firmware might be cool, but that counts as ripping them off directly, as does moving VC games, though they should have a program in place for people who need to buy a new wii for any reason. ISOs are a grey aria depending on how many people do it, but if you're not going to put a MOD chip in your system, you shouldn't touch the Firmware. Let's try NOT to put Nintendo out of business here, shall we?

[DPyro]

Online gameplay on Wii? Who gives a damn? They have severely gimped the online in all of their products, and it doesn't even work very well. Try playing a game of SSBB online and tell me you enjoy it.

[kingslime80]

That doesn't mean there won't be better on-line play in the future. I for one would rather have the option weather or not to use it and not play with it then want to play on-line and not be able to. I also know I'm not the only one. I'd rather have a nerfed game then a nerfed system.

[____anders____]

yeah, it should've been like, picking servers or something like that, and if anyone ever makes a CFW for the wii i meant online play like Xlink kai for xbox, cus it's pretty good, at least for being free..

the only bad thing about xlink kai is:
1. not so many players :(.
2. pretty hard to set up, but once you have done that, just play, and it gets 100 times easier if you have Xbox Media Center..

[SSaxdude]

I don't think will have much, if any, effect on the Wii. There's already emulators for Wii. Piracy of Wii games has been around for some time, yet Wii sales are very good.

[DimensionT]

I don't think will have much, if any, effect on the Wii. There's already emulators for Wii. Piracy of Wii games has been around for some time, yet Wii sales are very good.

Pirates are much more inclined to torrent a game and stick it on their Wii then going through setting up the Twilight hack to boot emulators.

[kingslime80]

I don't think will have much, if any, effect on the Wii. There's already emulators for Wii. Piracy of Wii games has been around for some time, yet Wii sales are very good.

While that IS true, I was more thinking the home-made firmware updates will only brick people's wiis and is not any better then a Mod Chip, maybe not even that good. There are things we'd all like to see implimented, but this isn't the way to go about it.:(

[hypochondriac]

The wii is primarily a family console. Only hardcore gamers are going to bother with all this. I predict it will have a very tiny impact yet the wii will continue to sell extremely well.

[kingslime80]

I hope your right Hypo.

[____anders____]

yeah, it's not going to affect N that much imo.. but i think that theyr'e going to patch this anyway...
and there goes TP hack down:(

[OHMYGAWD]

ty vc piracy

[sleekgeek]

man some of you kids are huge d-bags and/or simply ignorant. nintendo makes $100 PURE PROFIT on each console sold and they have sold millions! VC games should be free from the start.

you kids crying about developers not getting paid... wtf are you talking about? this isn't atari 2600 it's the wii. the developers get $80K a year starting pay backed by muti-billion dollar publishers. nobody is starving. these are the companies that make games for money not your enjoyment. that is why 9/10 games on the wii are mini-game crap.

oh noes nintendo might patch your homebrew so you have to buy that $40 tetris disc instead of downloading it and taking money away from the publisher. you wont beable to play your pirated roms that the big n hunts little websties down for.

simply don't update. the machine is hacked now so there will always be a workaround. if you kids want homebrew go buy a PSP.

in other news this is great. just a step towards having another totally opened console.

[tehnoir]

man some of you kids are huge d-bags and/or simply ignorant. nintendo makes $100 PURE PROFIT on each console sold and they have sold millions! VC games should be free from the start.

Pure profit after what has been figured in? Hardware costs? The cost of R&D? The costs associated with running such a large company? Costs associated with licensing?
And why should VC games be free? Granted, they're older games, but it still takes time, work and money to code them to run on a Wii. It's capitalism. Whatever profits Nintendo makes, they are entitled to. If you don't agree with capitalism, don't participate.

[kingslime80]

Sleekgeek, it is YOU who is the "d-bag". First, how can ANY company make 100% profit off of ANY console? There's materials, labor, development costs, PROGRAMMING, thus any console that makes more then 50% profit is very lucky. Remember the VirtualBoy? And an 80k STARTING salary? Maybe in Yen. ESPECIALLY since Nintendo was not far from BANKRUPTCY recently. I FULLY support HOMEBREW, but when you start talking custom firmware, you start talking about people screwing up their machines and putting themselves on Nintendo's radar. You shine THAT big of a light on homebrew and nintendo will likely shut down what I view as the only true quality site for homebrew in the first place. Sure there may be others, but none as good. Now please people, stop talking out of your @$$ before that happens.

I've been a lifelong Nintendo supporter, and YES, the VC should have been free in the first place, but be realistic. That won't happen. I support fun games, fun times, good story in RPGs and the only true gaming company left on the market. You want custom Firmware, go brick your own machine like a good little d-bag, just don't come crying to me when the firmware makes any decent games unplayable.

Leave those of us who want fun that's affordable have ours, and I'll let you do what you want, but don't get us shut down.

[Jay6]

nintendo makes $100 PURE PROFIT on each console sold and they have sold millions!

First, how can ANY company make 100% profit off of ANY console?
I see what you did there... you misread it.
And I don't support piracy. I'd rather pay for my games if I can get them... and if you already own a game that has been made into a VC game, then simply don't buy the VC game because you already own it. Unless you want to play that game on your Wii, then you'll have to fork over a little bit of money. $5 to $12 for a decently good old game isn't bad. Where else can you find a copy Harvest Moon for $8? Or Super Metroid? Of course, there are plenty of crappy games on the VC... and if you don't want to pay for crap, then don't buy it.

[tehnoir]

Heh, I misread it as 100% at first and was glad I caught myself before replying :)