Sonys playing dirty pool

[shadowprophet]

Somthing just hit me call it a stroke of insperation
or just seeing beyond the excitment of the psone emu for psp :eek:

But If sony does release an offical psone emu for the psp:eek:

Wouldnt that officaly make all other psone emus past preasent or future, OFFICAL WAREZ:eek::eek:

Now far be it from me to Call this psp psone emu and offical attack on homebrew,
But screw you sony, screw you and the horse you rode in on :mad:
By makeing psone emus warez, that means not only will the psone homebrew emus become rare and hard to find because sites like dcemu will refuse to host them, But this attack will have a wider range possibly effecting other emus aswell
:(

Comments please!

[JoshM248]

Oh Well. You win some you lose some. I didn't really care to much for PS1 anyhow.

[Cap'n 1time]

Omg Shadow Is Soooooooo Cute!

[tsaikimon]

Ummmm they are just programs. They use all original code so why would an official Sony ps1 emu convert them into something illegal. The only illegal thing would be the rom right?

[NoQuarter]

I think it's only illegal if you don't own the original game and PS1

[djakku]

Even if it's called Warez, all the emu on PSP should be called like that then...
So basically you're reaction is right, you've got a point but isn't it the same problem for all other emu? Why espacially PSOne is the problem?
playing snesx, neogeo, Gameboy and now n64 is already considered illegal by sony, am i wrong?

[felonyr301]

you dont get what he means which is now that its official it means bye bye to making an ps1 emulator and possibly never really able to talk about it here cause its illegal and they might just break apart this site (which will make me cry) but the deal with the other emulators being illegal unless they make an official one then uhmm no they cant do squat only nintendo and the other companies can if they wanted to but i think they rather have sony have trouble dealing with it themselves and making sony look like the bad guys lol yea i hate sony sometimes oops i mean most of the time..

[djakku]

ok now i get it, thank for straighting things up, then i'll say skrew you sony! :p
or maybe we're the one skrewed....

[luis_05]

I'm new, two questions. What the hell is warez? and how will it affect other homebrew games?

[Emeriastone]

I just see it as sony making sure no one rips off their PS1 titles so easily...

[shadowprophet]

Warez is anything that is an offical comercial release (IE, stolen or pirated content ):(
Warez is bad, For many reasons,
It harms the homebrew scene, Buy causing us grief from comercial developers and enought of that grief will get even an honest site like Dcemu shut down, :(

[vettacossx]

right so get your epsxe plugin updates now! and all the bios avilable everything you MAY need in the futer

[fpcreator2000]

Just because Sony releases an official emu doesn't mean that unofficial emus are illegal, except those using official SDKs 'cause you're using code libraries owned by someone else without proper licencing. So if emus are made dev kits not stolen from sony or contains material owned by a specific rights holder, it is perfectly fine. But I don't know the laws of europe so I couldn't tell you. Example, Bleem for Dreamcast was not illegal, the group didn't have the funds to compete with sony -//end Part I

[neoalucard]

even when sony releases their official emu, that doesn't change anything... to be very specific, even epsxe is illegal to have unless you own a "legitimate" bio that you flashed yourself unto your computer...

For those of you that downloaded the psx bios on the internet or have a psx emulator that had bios already included.... news flash... you already broke the law.

Therefore.... why should other non-sony released emulators become warez? After all, all it is , is a program designed to replicate another program/system/application, the emulator has always been legal... because you couldn't technically run the program without a legitimate bio...

having the emulator , and having it work via a downloaded bio... is where the legality is in question...
if you didn't flash the bio yourself.... it is indeed illegal... but lets face it people... with knowing that... how many of you flashed your own bio... or better yet... dumped your own roms for other emulators... ( we all know how hard it was to find those illegal bios/roms ) -insert sarcasim here- so then i think we have nothing to worry about even if a psx emu was "considered" illegal, just for the sake of the program excluding the bio... i think most of us here wouldn't have too much of a problem acquiring it...

[drquack02]

I believe this would make Sony PS1 emulators for the PSP illegal...even that is a strech.

Everyone can always say, this is made for homebrew, and generally thats the end of it.

I doubt any difference to come from this.

[fpcreator2000]

-// continued (PSP memory limitations on how much I can type.//-

sony in court so the only compromise was to stop production, update, and distribution of the emu, or keep at it at the courts. Of course, Sony has deeper pockets. But the emu was never deemed illegal. Plus homebrew is only illegal if you are using material that doesn't belong and/or was not licenced to you. Warez would be distributing a program without proper licencing like Sony's firmware updates, that's warez, but Sony wants you to update.

[cloud_952]

o_o "warez" is when you make an illegal copy of a copyrighted program. Emulators are not using Sony's code base, and are NO MORE legal now than they will be when Sony releases their own emulator.

So, I really don't see what the point in this discussion is. o_O

[Voltron]

I don't think its that big of a deal. It will not be so easy to get a website shut down.

I am happy that Sony is working on a PSOne Emu for the PSP. This can be looked at as the ultimate showdown. Sony's PS1 EMU vs. Homebrew PS1 EMU. Who can develop the best PSOne EMU.

Sure Sony can stand to make some $$$ of their venture. But there are quite a few EXTREMELY talented coders who contribute the the PSP hombrew community. And I think it would be good motivation if Sony started releasing their own branded homebrew. Only it would not be homebrew. It would be SOny brew or whatever you want to call it.

Actually, the more I think of it. It would make the most sense for Sony to make the PSOne EMU playable on ALL firmware versions. I have no intentions on upgrading. But I would spend $5.00 - $10.00 on quite a few PSOne games. If Sony could get the file sizes trimmed with maybe a proprietary compression technology so that many games could fit on to a 1 or 2 Gig PRO Duo, I'd buy a whole bunch of PS1 ROMS.

But if the Sony PS1 EMU only works on Firmware 2.70 or 3.00 or whatever, and someone else is able to code a practical PS1 EMU, I won't pay for the PS1 ROMS and I'll make my own backups of the games I already own.

Anyway, I don't think we have anything to worry about.

[nielsss]

i think that this is a way to make us upgrade to higher firmware. i mean when that emu comes will all have to upgrade if we want to use it sony will not make it work under 2.70

[Larry]

Sony isnt making an actual emulator. persay, if they did, pirating psone games would be so easy on all firmwares, they wouldnt make any money,

no, they are porting the games over in a sense. there IS an emulator BUT! its part of the game itself and not a 3rd program.

This will not make psone emu's for the psp wares.

So the psp emulates the psone while playing those games,. but the psp doesnt run an emulator and then the game.

The concepts are different.
Double check the press conference. ^_^ thats how i figured this out.

[robotdevil]

Wow, very interesting concept Larry. Also, everyone's so focused on this being a PS1 EMU they think that Sony will be dumb enough to release ROMs. Personally, I believe Sony will be putting the older games out on UMD (like how Nintendo released their "Classic" series for GBA). And again (agreeing with all who said it before) EMU's are NOT illegal, some of the code required to make them functional is (i.e. BIOS dumps, roms, etc). All of you with NesterJ and ROMs you didn't dump have broken the law. Especially if you have ROMs that you never owned. But back to my point, how did you get those ROMs for NES? Exactly, the same thing would happen to PS1 ROMs. I'm not saying I wouldn't like to see PS1 off the memstick (would really help batt life), but I don't think it's a realistic expectation. Lets give Sony a little credit, they are a giant evil corporation bent on ruling every facet of their systems, but they aren't stupid. But lets see if we can learn from this, if Sony does release them as downloadable ROMs that's going to give us ALOT of materials to work with. Alot of eboots to be unpacked and dissected. And I agree with Voltron, who better to create a PS1 emu? Lets face it, they know more about both systems than anyone else.

And I also agree that this won't stop the homebrew scene from creating their own EMU, DCEMU might not host it :( but some of the other, eh, less reputable sites would. And there's allways bittorrent.....

[MikeDX]

Shadow, if you shaved your goatee off and ditch those shades, I'd join your gang :D

[shadowprophet]

where the hell have you been ?
I havnt seen you on irc in a while :p

[AcerVentura]

Shadowprophet, you need to catch up on some sleep, dude.

Next you'll be telling us Sony killed JFK and Elvis.


Besides, Sony's offering is only an "emulator" by very loose definition. It sounds like instead of making the PSP think that its a PS1, they are just re-compiling PS1 games to run on PSP.

Think of Capcom and Namco and Midway classic re-releases. Not really emulating, just porting the games to PSP platform.

[MikeDX]

where the hell have you been ?
I havnt seen you on irc in a while :p

I couldnt get on efnet for some reason, my ip range seems to be blacklisted :(

[shadowprophet]

Shadowprophet, you need to catch up on some sleep, dude.

Next you'll be telling us Sony killed JFK and Elvis.


Besides, Sony's offering is only an "emulator" by very loose definition. It sounds like instead of making the PSP think that its a PS1, they are just re-compiling PS1 games to run on PSP.

Think of Capcom and Namco and Midway classic re-releases. Not really emulating, just porting the games to PSP platform.

Sony did kill JFK,

Elvis told me so ;) lol

[Larry]

Besides, Sony's offering is only an "emulator" by very loose definition. It sounds like instead of making the PSP think that its a PS1, they are just re-compiling PS1 games to run on PSP.


like what i said. :D

But ya if they make a 3rd software emulator, and then have seperate roms.

it would be as easy to use illegals as it would be to use those spiffy nes roms.

So ya, porting, re-compiling, all that stuff is the only logical way to do it to avoid piracy as much as possible for downloadables.

long live ps1

[slaphappygamer]

so emulatoin is ok as long as $ony releases it. those hippo-crits.

[goldensupersonic]

Ummmmmm who said it would be an emu it could be just bootable ISOs on the PSP.

[Lumir]

Seriously. This topic is over-rated. Until the actuall information on the sony proclaimed ps1 emu is out i suggest we all just wait. I also noticed that the ridge racer game displayed at e3 did not boot through a emu like the snes emu we all know. Instead it booted strait from the mem stick as a game. Just like our homebrew, in fact exactly like it.

I speculate along with everyone here that sony has come up with some kind of compiler, transformer, to transform ps1 games into eboots bootable strait off the mem stick. If thats the case then either that will be hacked to allow older firmware versions a chance, or an actuall ps1 emu will come out. If not on this site, on a site somewere in africa, if not on a site on bittorrent.

[Apoklepz]

Ummmmmm who said it would be an emu it could be just bootable ISOs on the PSP.

Yeah, I too thought about this... The ISOS or PSone games might just be recompiled to a new format by SONY. A new format that only upcoming firmwares will understand and run.

In case they do release a PSone amulator within the future firmware it will only be a matter of time till someone can hack the firmware and extract the emulator...not an easy task at all, too.

I read some details about this supposed PSone "emulator" by Sony and the source (sorry don't remember) said that Sony will sell some kind of card (MS stick?) compatible with the PSP for $50+ wherein this card will be the only support for the games/isos/roms or whatever format they will be in...So I guess anyone who wants this will either have to wait a long time for a hack or just plain upgrade.

BTW... I've been saying SCREW SONY since they made the PSP non-homebrew with their stupid security patches & firmware.

...1.50 till death, baby!

[rock_light]

woot! I knew Sony bought VGS for a reason!

Yeah sony would be stupid to make a direct emulator that loads games. We all know how impractical that would be due to compatibility issues and all that.

No Warez are not hurting the scene in any way. That only the uneducated dreamers believe this. There is NO affordable way to copy umds.
Their are almost as many PSPs over 2.01 out there as originals. (Just wait till the price drop)

Copying ISOs to your MEM stick is impractical buggy and there's plenty of games that are just worth buying instead or just dont work with f/w emu . And
trust me the people that really care will buy another PSP or Upgrade.

(I'd buy another PSP cuz untill an internal MOD or Unofficial UMD comes out 1.5 will be worth more than the Cheaper 3.0)

Anyways now that you can DL games we will probobly see online downloadable installs for games smaller in size. We'll most likely see some more popular franchizes out there first too.

As for my main point. Hey anyone remember when Sony bought out the most impressive clean, easy to use, professional emu to ever hit the scene?

Yeah I'm talking about 'Connectix' Virtual Game Station!

We only saw one update for the emulator before sony shut it down! Back when PSX was still selling games.

Thats right they bought it. They didn't twist any laws around to try and throw them in jail. No suing.
They did legal business payed Connectix to stop production and sell them the source code.

One of the most impressive things about VGS is it did NOT require sony bios to run.

Wonder if sony will use any of this code in their PSX ports for PSP. (Hmmmm...)

Anyways yeah warez. Pfff whatever.
(All my projects are opensource anyways. Game projects should be fun, f**** to profit)

As for warez laws I have about as much respect for them as I do drug patents so I'll just try not to talk about my thoughts on it as much as possible here.

=]

*Oh yeah. Pirates out there may be familiar with the sega smash pack. You've seen what that game can really do. Maybe the same idea can be applied here too.

[F9zDark]

as demonstrated by the Pre-E3 demo by SCE, the PS1 demos on PSP boot straight to the game after download (although it's possible that there will be an option outside of the boot menu before the game starts.)

http://www.dcemu.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=24451

There is all the information you need...


From that article it can be construed that the PS1 is indeed an emulator. To make the emulator survive from a business standpoint Sony would have to release 1000s of games, from all genres to get people interested in buying PS1 games for the PSP.

Now imagine having to go in, rewrite and test every PS1 game that is ported to PSP. It just isn't possible, not when an emulator is the most cost effective way (since 1 simple line of code can make 100 games more compatible with it).

And given the information in that article, "when you go to controller options, you see the ancient PS1 white controller, pre-DualShock"

Obviously a port would have removed that and replaced it with a PSP (since why not, if the developers are already making said PS1 game ported to the PSP, how hard is it to just change 1 JPEG and a few variables dealing with controller layout?)

Having vestages of the PS1 interface proves that the games are merely emulated...

[vettacossx]

SHADOW WHAT AN AWSOME TOPIC GOOD LOOK BRO!!!


Next you'll be telling us Sony killed JFK and Elvis.


carfull that mo-fo shadow is crazy as hell...and he told me he had a shiny new wiffle bat.....and its a brandished and ready to take the sand out of your vagina!!!!
lmao

i hope they do port them.....if we could port ISO to psp 2.7 that prooves a concept....maybe those lying halo umd porter *******s,,,,.....arent lying *******s after all!!!

if sony can port a ps1 ISO whats to stop us from LEARNING from these ports and making our own

after all halo was a PC game as well and we have ported QUAKE!!,DOOM, this is only the begining of psp homebrew look at the dreamcast still making gr8 homebrew today....talk about replay value!!!!!!!!!!

[AcerVentura]

http://www.dcemu.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=24451

There is all the information you need...


From that article it can be construed that the PS1 is indeed an emulator. To make the emulator survive from a business standpoint Sony would have to release 1000s of games, from all genres to get people interested in buying PS1 games for the PSP.





Who said anything about 1000s of games? Not Sony. I'm betting they'll have about 100 downloadable titles by summer 2008.

If they have an emulator that runs all PS1 titles, then why are they only showing RidgeRacer at E3??

LIKE PSP NEEDS ANOTHER DRIVING GAME...

[AcerVentura]

if sony can port a ps1 ISO whats to stop us from LEARNING from these ports and making our own



Last time I checked you need access to the Source Code in order to do a port.

We have access to Quake source. Only Sony has access to PSX sources.

[bah]

Why is this on the front page? Sonys patents and trademarks to the PS1 are still valid now, before a PSP PS1 emulator exitsts.

There is no relation between the 2.

I'm Guessing the emulator will be similar to bleem!, with a similar, but optimised to the specific game, emulator being bundled in with the data of the original game for each 'rom' you download from them.

Its all just conjecture for the moment, chill Shadow (and here I thaught you saw the world through rose coloured glasses :)

[F9zDark]

Who said anything about 1000s of games? Not Sony. I'm betting they'll have about 100 downloadable titles by summer 2008.

If they have an emulator that runs all PS1 titles, then why are they only showing RidgeRacer at E3??

LIKE PSP NEEDS ANOTHER DRIVING GAME...

Looking at it from a business standpoint, for the emulator to survive there will need to be two things:

1)Substantial game base to cater to the sweeping desires of the PSP audience. 100 games might work for launch, but there would need to be a great deal more than that released later on to make their efforts profitable.

2)Ease of interoperability. More time spent making the games work = less profits. Obviously Sony is taking the emulation route since it offers the least amount of work for the most profits compared to porting every title they plan on releasing.

Considering the amount of games that PS1 has in Japan that we don't have in America, I think there being 1000 titles worldwide for this emulator is not a far cry from the truth.

[craig588]

This means every FPS game after Wolf 3D is illegal too! Every smooth scrolling platformer after Mario! (Nintendo actually did try to sue about that IIRC, but they lost)

You can copywright the implementation, but you can't copywrite the idea of an emulator. Hence, almost all Xbox homebrew is illegal because it's made using a stolen SDK, but unless Sony makes a mistake and someone leaks the source to their emulator all homebrewed PSP PSX emulators will be legal.

[F9zDark]

if sony can port a ps1 ISO whats to stop us from LEARNING from these ports and making our own


Why do people assume that the PS1 games will be ISOs? They clearly wont be!

Sony will obviously release the games in a format that the PSP and Emulator can read, probably encrypted with AES so that we cannot mess with them and expect them to still work afterwards.

Trust me, Sony is not just going to willingly hand us ISOs of their PS1 games...

[Cooe14]

How do I flash the BIOS from my PS1?

[modcase]

"Wouldnt that officaly make all other psone emus past preasent or future, OFFICAL WAREZ :eek: :eek: "

I still fail to see how people still get confused with downloadable content as a business concept. You've got to be joking to think that Just because you can download something off the net, which gives you the "ability" to share it doesn't mean its free or legal to do so.

Just to get it out of the way emulators are legal thanks to Sony vs Connetix. So sony emulating its own product as you might guess is fine. Distributing it over the net is fine. When you get to sharing it with others, is when it starts to become a problem.

No matter what your doing, getting a MP3 or application from a torrent, or getting the lastest PSP game isos, if you aren't paying then you can just rest assured, that people are watching they could eventually take notice and do something about it.

[Drunken]

"screw you sony!" :D

Psst... sony im sorry i said screw u you know ps1 emu is still always nice and i think they are just using plain hypocracy not to use emulators when they are making 1 themselves -.- just BULLLLLLLLLLL and yea... even if people dont alrdy own the game they will find ways to get the games free.. just the world we live in cause people are greedy and just dont wana hand it to us!!! uhh i mean :)

Personally i think they should make ps1 emu and sell roms? or sumthing like that... or a UMD filled with ps1 roms xD

lol...

[shadowprophet]

And thats okay, its more then funny enough to make up for it to the few people who will get it lol
- Bonanza's thoughts on sony-
It helps to imagine the bonanza theme song while reading this lol

We tried out our luck till we found out it sucked - Screw Sony
Like Soap on a rope In a poorly told joke
Firmware screwed us all

We all got told that our firmware is old - Screw sony!

But a war has begun and homebrews number one- how dumb can they really be?

On this land we put our brand
Homebrew is the name

Fortune smiled the day Fanjita rose to fame

We are the best, We pased your every test -So sony rot in hell

If anyone fights to protect your homebrew right
It sure as hell is me!

Sony blows, fanjita knows
Every source and line

No one works fights or beats
the homebrew grandline

So Here we stand, But on the other hand- Screw Sony
Like Soap on a rope In a poorly told joke
Firmware screwed us all

We got ahold of a potful of gold -But sony still smokes pole

- Screw sony -
- Screw Sony -

Yeah Yeah so I got bored and riped apart a classic theme song:rolleyes:
Its not the worst of my sins by far lol :D

lol I dunno just ignore me, I probibly havnt had my happy pills today lol :D

[RedKing14CA]

The revolution, or "wii" as the *******s call it now, will ALSO make ROMS illegal by Nintendo charging money for all their past games....

[stotheamuel]

quite an old show

We got ahold of a potful of gold - sony is just jealus.......bananzaa (Dododododo bananza)

i answered two if its okay? i couldn't resist but to choose cute too.

(lend some of them happy pills in my direction)

[neoalucard]

Q: How do I dump a PlayStation BIOS?
A: To dump a PlayStation BIOS, you need a GameShark or Action replay and a PC comms
link. To start, you need either a real Caetla module or go to altavista and search
for "Caetla" (it's a BIOS replacement for your module, so properly read the included
documentation before installing it!!). Now upload "Caetla", and use use the caetla
commands for downloading a binary memory image from the region 0x0bfc00000 -
0x0bfc7ffff! Now save the image as SCPHxxxx.bin, where xxxx is your PSX's model number,
and ePSXe will recognise it and use it from now on.