Legality of Custom Gameboots Produced with Sony's Leaked Tools [Archive] - DCEmu Network: The Homebrew, Hacking & Gaming Network

F9zDark

July 29th, 2006, 20:38

Heres a Public Service Announcement and we at DCEmu fully agree with the statement ahead

With the recent slew of custom gameboots coming down the pipes, many here may be jumping for joy at the prospect. But there is a problem with them: they may be illegal.

The problem arises from the tools that produce them, which, if you are unaware, were leaked a few days ago ( you can read about it here: http://www.dcemu.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=30167 ) Some members have claimed to have downloaded these leaked tools and others have outright released what they have made with them.

With the limited understanding of the laws in the US that I have, I firmly believe that these gameboots are illegal.

Just like developers need to get a license to develop software for the PSP that will be 'official' software, so too do developers need to get a license to use the UMD software package that was leaked.

The license also applies to any information released using the products. If the party isn't licensed to use the software, they aren't licensed to release anything they make with it.

This package may have been included as part of PSP dev-kits, which, if you are a homebrew developer, you already know that all software made with these dev-kits, if acquired illegally, are illegal (and no self respecting homebrew site would knowingly allow those files to be hosted on their servers).

This legal problem can and very well be the end of homebrew sites as we know them, if something is not done about this.

Sony has a vested interest in these tools and what can be made with them, and I believe that if we allow for dicussion of these tools and files made. released, and distributed using these tools, that we can gurantee that Sony will have more than enough reason to shut down homebrew sites.

So far, we have maintained an image of legality, to which Sony may have some respect for us. But Sony could probably shut this or any site down at will, without proper evidence for it. So just imagine how easy their job would be, if they had evidence for it...

Let's not give Sony a reason to shut us down.

Message from Webmaster

Can all PSP visitors and members please not at all upload or link to gameboots on DCEmu servers, any material should be deleted ASAP or risk being banned.

wraggster

July 29th, 2006, 20:54

thanks for the info, people do need to take notice

nielsss

July 29th, 2006, 20:58

hmm i have to agree altough i have downloaded these leaked tools viaa torrent but i dont know how to use use them :p and that gangs of london aswel so i would't want homebrew sites to close down, so i agree

blaz3d

July 29th, 2006, 21:36

as i saw the gameboots being released i couldnt belive it was legitimate to redistribute theese files:confused:

nuff sed there not that cool anyway:rolleyes:

peace

wraggster

July 29th, 2006, 21:38

anyone sees them please report to a mod or pm me and ill deal with them

Screwie5150

July 29th, 2006, 21:43

I was wondering the legality of all the new gameboots that are coming out... thanks for the 411

acn010

July 29th, 2006, 21:47

oh wow, lol, the tools leaked, now what?
lol.

dtothabreezy

July 29th, 2006, 22:03

i liked (shoosh ikept one) but i dint think they would be illegal but this thred has kept me informed thx sonys really havein a ruff time arent they

Pico

July 29th, 2006, 22:51

I think you'll find any software made for the psp needs to be licensed for it to be legal. So why bother posting this as news.

MaxSMoke

July 29th, 2006, 22:52

Under the Digital Millennium Copyright act, all forms of Homebrew and the methods of making them work are illegal because they bypass safeguards designed to protect against unauthorized usage of Sony's hardware.

So you entire website is illegal. Whether you have a Gameboot or not will hardly make a difference. The only reason Sony hasn't shut down this website is just because they aren't ready yet to commit the legal resources to shut it down. Instead they want to demonstrate their technical prowess by out-coding Homebrew makers with more and more Firmware updates.

ALL FORMS OF SYSTEM EXPLOITS ARE ILLEGAL UNDER THE DMCA.

This includes all of the exploits used to load all Homebrew games. The GTA loader, the swap technique, all of those "%" files. All of them are devices to bypass Sony's lockouts, and all of them are illegal under the DMCA.

SONY WANTS TO SHUT DOWN ALL UNAUTHORIZED PSP DEVELOPMENT INCLUDING HOMEBREW.

Don't even think for a moment they are cool with any kind of Homebrew software, regardless of the form it takes. You're website is the Enemy as far as they are concerned.

I know alot of you are young kids with idealistic visions of the difference between Homebrew and ISO loaders. But to Sony, they are all the same thing. Go ask Sony, they will happily inform you of all of the technical and legal reasons why you should never run Homebrew of any kind.

Now, please stop being such a weenie and report *ALL* PSP news for a change. This website is beginning to go down hill. I had to learn about Dev Hook from Google. You can keep hiding your heads in the sand, but that won't stop Sony from bringing this place down whenever it suits them. All you're doing hurting the website and doing an extreme disservice to your readers.

PLEASE REPORT THE NEWS!

under_0ath777

July 29th, 2006, 23:07

hmmm, i run custom firmware so i dont need % :O

F9zDark

July 29th, 2006, 23:16

Yet, laws regarding Reverse Engineering and Interoperability make it all legal. So where do we stand now?

Also, 1.0 PSPs came without protection measures, so homebrew is legal on them.

The amount of money Sony would spend to take anyone to court is mere pocket change to them. The court costs of the party involved as the defendant, on the other hand, is far higher than most sites revenue.

That is how businesses get what they want in court. They simply bring someone they don't like to court and run them into the ground with court costs and legal fees.

As I said in the article, Sony is doing us a favor by not shutting this site down as it is (even though homebrew is legal). But when they find out that their tools, which cost in upwards of 2000 USD, are being used illegally and without monetary compensation, they will be more than happy to step in.

DPyro

July 29th, 2006, 23:26

Don't worry...There will be a legit way of creating pmf files soon enough ;)

INKED

July 29th, 2006, 23:31

long story short...u no give sony money, sony says **** YOU...but with a lawyer

Voltron

July 29th, 2006, 23:51

1.0 PSPs came without protection measures, so homebrew is legal on them.

Excellent Point!

So you entire website is illegal. Whether you have a Gameboot or not will hardly make a difference.

Yes, I'm sick of the whining and complaining and over-emphasis at the idea that this site might get shut down at the mere mention of ISO's and now... gameboots, LOL.... Ridiculous!

Don't even think for a moment they are cool with any kind of Homebrew software, regardless of the form it takes. You're website is the Enemy as far as they are concerned.

Exactly, nice to hear people start telling it like it is. Some of the most important work in PSP homebrew gets very little mention here. DevHook, custom firmware, etc. Its amazing that I can talk endlessly about a PS2 ISO emulator if I was trying to code one, but not PSP ISO emulation. Owell, it will be interesting to see the direction this site takes in the near future as more and more breakthroughs and exploits are uncovered.

F9zDark

July 29th, 2006, 23:54

Don't worry...There will be a legit way of creating pmf files soon enough ;)

If a coder can find a way to encode PMF files without relying on Sony software (ie a homebrew PMF encoder) then custom gameboots can become legal.

As well reverse engineering a game to extract the PMF is legal as well, so long as that PMF isn't distributed.

kfish2oo2

July 29th, 2006, 23:55

It true, all forms of homebrew (which bypass ANY security measures) are illegal. The fact that Sony hasnt cracked down on this site or any other dedicated homebrew site just shows how much they love their money and their coders. But the main truth of the matter is this: the percentage of homebrew users and the percentage of regular updaters who dont have a clue about homebrew goes something like this, respectivly: 0.03% and 99.07%. In truth, sony are losing so little money over homebrew that its just not a perceived threat. Once the homebrew scene grows big enough to be a threat, then the legal actions begin. However, with the release of the seemingly uncrackable fw 2.7, the chances of the homebrew scene growing enough to be threatening are slim. Us happy few who discovered homebrew in the early days are probably safe for a good while yet REGARDLESS of what is discussed on this website.

DPyro

July 30th, 2006, 00:03

Number of people with 1.50 vs other firmware (http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/poll_view?poll.id=8463&action=view_results)

F9zDark

July 30th, 2006, 00:07

DPyro

July 30th, 2006, 00:29

You may very well be right. But discussion of topics that directly result in Sony's loss of income, will result in expendient legal action.

Look at this thread, discussing the tools release: http://www.dcemu.co.uk/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=26530&highlight=Composer.

You see that price? 200,000 Yen. Now whats that in USD? 1,744.36 USD courtesy of www.xe.com.

Thats nearly 2,000 dollars. Since yesterday's post about gameboots, which is now deleted, I recall 3 users of this site who openly admitted to downloading the leaked software. Thats 6,000 USD out of Sony's pockets.

Way more than homebew ever cost them (I can't speak for everyone, but now with Devhook, I am buying more UMD games since I can run them on 1.5). That is why there needs to be a stop to this. Downloading and installing homebrew doesn't cost Sony 2000 dollars at a clip.
Sony doesnt lose any money because some lil kids got a leaked BETA of the software, which doesnt even have all the tools. Plus the fact the only thing they'll know howto do is create MPS files which arent very useful on their own. Sony, won't go after anyone with these tools. Just like they didnt go after anyone who got the leaked sdk src, or any ISO's of games.

zackforbing

July 30th, 2006, 01:08

Thats 6,000 USD out of Sony's pockets.

what an ignorant statement. You're basically saying that the people that downloaded this OTHERWISE would have bought it. come on.

Also- Sony can't sue you for modifying something you bought from them. once it's in your hands, it's YOURS. sony should have NO say in what you do or don't do with it. that said- if someone SELLS a piece of software made with these stolen tools, they'll have sony come down on them like a hawk.

I don't think sony can legally stop someone from making free software. they CAN stop you from using their tools, but "homebrew" as a whole is NOT illegal. Do you think Sony would allow it to exist if it was?

nyrtrublue

July 30th, 2006, 01:53

but are there legal gameboots?

SSaxdude

July 30th, 2006, 02:01

This whole "gameboots are illegal" thing is really silly. If we let Sony stop us from doing the smallest things, we will have to give up homebrew. Next, we will have to stop using emulators and games that use copyrighted sprites.
We must not do everything by what is considered legal.

kando

July 30th, 2006, 02:23

what exactly is a gameboot if i may ask?

notaforumtroll

July 30th, 2006, 02:39

The owners of this site must make a nice chunk of change off the advertisements and such scattered across this site to always be worried about whats legal and what is illegal, I'm pretty sure if sony wanted to they could shut the site down anytime based on the exchange of information on this site and what not.
all the links on the site, downgraders ect.
clearly this site is setup to advocate and distribute information for things that are not meant to be done on the psp.
$_$
love it or flame it, thats the truth.

kando

July 30th, 2006, 02:49

there are websites that promote pictures, articles, and other various things about illegal substances, that arent shut down...need i say more?

TheEmulatorGuy

July 30th, 2006, 03:05

The custom gameboots are just as illegal as the TIFF, KXploit and GTA exploits. Highly illegal, that is. Stop being a hypocrite. You're almost as bad as the people who choose to believe only some of the bible.

F9zDark

July 30th, 2006, 03:26

If you go over to PS2-Dev.org, and puruse their forums you will find countless PSP coders, PS2 coders and the like (the people who brought us the PSP SDK all by reverse engineering) who are well versed in the laws regarding Interoperability and Reverse Engineering.

Homebrew is legal so long as:

A)We use the homebrew SDK, which is solely derived from reverse engineering

B)We, obviously, do not break any other laws in the process.

Interoperability is a law that allows the end user to take any computer or electronic product that they own and make it function with any software or hardware that they own.

As far as I know, the law in DMCA adheres only to mediums of information that were affected by the slew of illegal music downloads that spurred the RIAA into action. (That law is the direct result of those actions by the RIAA).

Homebrew is legal. Gameboots, at least in the way that they are made now, are not.

If anyone can figure out a method to encode PMF files using a homemade program, then Sony has got nothing on us about that.

YourStillWithMe

July 30th, 2006, 04:18

I will 100% totally admit that I downloaded the sony leaked tools i have a DECENT grasp of how to operate the .pmf creater (still havent made one yet.) I just need to form the right bitrate in the file and frames within it and im golden. I seriously think wraggster and the ones who are against this have a point, it is wrong to some extent and i totally agree but at the same time it sounds stupid

We all know that like 90% of us dont own all the NES, SNES, gamegear, gameboy advance, gameboy color games that we emulate but we still do it. That's illegal!!!!! I myself own a vast majority of NES games (over 250) and i own a lot of snes games so i dont see myself as being "evil." This is very opinionated. All I'm saying to each and every one of you is to respect this sites choice to not support gameboots as I will. I do not plan to upload any gameboot.pmf's to this site that are customized and nor should any of you.

Regards

doof69

July 30th, 2006, 06:35

what exactly is a gameboot, i am lost. lol :)

pokothehobo

July 30th, 2006, 06:47

what exactly is a gameboot, i am lost. lol :)

same here bro... what do they do??

all of you are so wrapped up in the legality of the gameboots, is there realy some sort of advantage to them?

ACID

July 30th, 2006, 07:03

I think you'll find any software made for the psp needs to be licensed for it to be legal. So why bother posting this as news.
So people can know whats going on thats why.

Voltron

July 30th, 2006, 07:10

Sure, respect this site but whats next? First no mention of ISO's (even though PSP ISO's is coded into the sites html for search and descriptive purposes), then no mention of DevHook except the "legal" version, then gameboots???? Give me a break. It is getting very silly and as an unfortunate bi-product a lot of this sites members are spending a lot of time on other sites and forums. A big loss to this site as it has undoubtedly been the best. Will this silliness continue or will this site lighten up? Time will tell. I'm hoping for the latter.

::EDIT::
Definition of gameboot:

the gameboot.pmf is the video file that shows you that Sony PSP splash screen logo everytime you turn your PSP on or launch a UMD/homebrew, etc. You can flash your 1.50 PSP with a custom gameboot or a more safe way is to simply overwrite the gameboot file in the firmware folders that you use with DevHook.

I happen to use the bloody claws slashing gameboot which splatters blood all over the Sony PSP logo before launching an ISO (whoops) I mean UMD. A very cool and easy to perform modification of the PSP.

IMPORTANT:
It is important to note especially if you are flashing your PSP (1.50 firmware) that whatever gameboot you use needs to be LESS than 1mb in file size. The gameboot I use is around 516kb.

YourStillWithMe

July 30th, 2006, 07:17

Voltron-You make a very good point my friend. I seriously understand where your coming from in spite of the iso talk, and legal devhook version. Seriously, how many of you have the "legal" version of devhook? I do not, why would I want a version of devhook with lesser characteristics and capabilities? Thats like saying you would rather have a 1GB memory stick for your psp than a 4GB your cheating yourself. Sure I DL my share of games but i dont care because I have money and own plenty of UMD's and probably more than most of you (not to brag but i own over 50 games and movies and paid for them with my own money.) I also own 2 psp's, two 1GB sticks and a 2gb stick (am planning on getting the 4gb) so i support the distrubtors. I understand keeping the ISOS on the down low but a "movie clip" that we got our hands on? Thats kinda funny. To keep everyone happy i say this go to w w w. psp crazy.com if you wish to be illegal

Mr. Shizzy

July 30th, 2006, 08:33

what exactly is a gameboot if i may ask?

It's the little video that plays when your PSP boots up.;) .

Well this has been an intersting thread. It seems that many ppl don't know what's legal and what's not.:( . Most homebrew is NOT illegal. This includes *Emulators, Homemade games, and MOST applications. :)
Now, what is illegal is the following:

Downloading the "BIOS" for a emulator that you don't actually own the real console of. BIOS are (basically) the brains of a game system. Alot of emulators don't require BIOS to run (NES, SNES, Genesis, Atari ect...). It is perfectly legal to install these emus on your PSP, even if you don't actually own a physical copy of the console. But- certain emu's do require the BIOS to run. Some examples would be- Atari Lynx, NeoGeo, NeoGeoCD ect... These emus won't run without the BIOS. If you don't actually own these consoles and you download the BIOS from some where to play it - than what you are doing is illegal.
But wait theres more. A "ROM" is (basicaly) a "virtual copy" of any given videogame. It is ILLEGAL to download a ROM that you don't actually own a physical copy of the real game of. :(
A ROM of a PSP game is called an "ISO". Again it is ILLEGAL to posess a ISO if you don't actually own a physical copy of that specific game. Generaly, any respectable web site will allow no dicussion about ISO's . (DCEMU is one of them so don't disrespect them by talking about ISOs or you may find yourself banned) The reason ISO's are generally looked down upon is all the piracy it has and will lead to. Piracy hurts the videogame industry we all love.
Also it is illegal to download a firmware. Firmwares are typically needed for things such as DEVHOOK & packaged in with "Automatic Downgraders". It is however legal to "dump" your own firmware off your PSP. :)
Also be careful of all the different applications out there for download; some of them are illegal. (You know your always safe here @ DCEMU of course!!!) Do your homework - so you actually know exactly what your getting youself into if your just surfing the web for stuff.
Now recently SONY's UMD creating tools have been leaked onto the internet; and it would obviously be ILLEGAL to download them. The only thing they would be useful to your everyday user for would be they enable you to make custom gameboots (if you know what your doing). ;) . Would it be illegal for an average user to download a custom gameboot? I'm not exactly sure. But I do know it probably wouldn't be a good idea for a website to host them unill there is a legal means of creating them.:(
Whatever this web site decides to do is what I'll respect. I'm proud to call PSP-news my virtual home away from home. This is THE BEST homebrew site on the internet.:D And again, you always know anything you downlod here is 100% LEGAL and I like that.:)
I myself am very interested about custom gameboots. But I would hate to lose my favorite hangout (DCEMU - psp-news) or get sued.:(

tophead420

July 30th, 2006, 09:10

i find it odd that sonys tools are being "leaked out" how does this happen there must be a spy or something lol but these new custom gameboots i havent seen one so i dont care about um i dont know a thing about um so thats good im sure they wouldnt be to hard to find tho well anyways i think they souldnt be put on or said anything about them on this site becuz i dont want dcemu to be gone becuz witout dcemu what is there for me to find the latest and greatest homebrew o yea pspupdates and F*** that S*** lol

motz

July 30th, 2006, 09:19

Number of people with 1.50 vs other firmware (http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/poll_view?poll.id=8463&action=view_results)

I can't believe how many people still have updated to 2.80. :mad:

Illegal Machine

July 30th, 2006, 09:36

With the limited understanding of the laws in the US that I have, I firmly believe that these gameboots are [b]illegal.

.[/U]

key word limited....

and I regard the legality of those tools and the related gameboots created as a result about as much as I give a damn about your limited understanding of the laws in the US that you have.

Now I never link anyone to anything. No rom links, no iso upload links, no gameboot uploads. nothing.... HOWEVER. YOU administrators of this site need to realize that nobody is going to come after you, nor is this or any other site going to be shut down as a result.

notaforumtroll

July 30th, 2006, 10:39

i find it odd that sonys tools are being "leaked out" how does this happen there must be a spy or something

Not spys, just pissed off, under paid over worked employees that spite the companies they work for. my guess they were probably leaked from Electronic arts.
Electronic arts having lost a law suit about over working their employees and well, releasing such shitty games these last couple years.

kersplatty

July 30th, 2006, 10:48

i used to think the custom gameboots were cool but now i know there illegal ill stop :D wudnt want this brilliant site going down would we

Ichijoe

July 30th, 2006, 12:17

Also it is illegal to download a firmware. Firmwares are typically needed for things such as DEVHOOK & packaged in with "Automatic Downgraders". It is however legal to "dump" your own firmware off your PSP. :)

Ahggh, Dude you are so full of **it!
How can you say that downloading Firmwarez is ileagle?!
S0NY®™, are practicly giving the stuff away by
Downloads. With the only noted execption beeing the
Packaged Updates that are on UMDs'™.

Could it be that I'm takeing you out of some form of
Context here? In so far as you ment: By downloading Dumped Firmware's.

As S0NY®™ wholy encourages People to download there ruddy Firmwarez
either off a *PC/MAC or though the 802.11b Wi-Fi on the PSP™, itself.

So why can I not leagaly hold on to say the last Five S0NY®™ Firmwarez
(2.00, 2.50, 2.60, 2.71 & 2.80), on my own Machine?!

Again your argument only holds H²O so long as you were refering to downloading
actuall dumps. Since Devhook makes dumping a sinch. Most People here should have
a grasp of (ms0://, ms0:/PSP/GAME... etc), I can not see any problems with it, as there
are tools to extract the 'reboot.bin' file off an emulated v2.50/60.

So yes I did cheated that One time! :p

*It sould be noted that yourpsp.com, is not Firefox compatible and requiers One to use IE6/7
(Infection Exploiter 6 or 7), as your Browser... :eek:

SSaxdude

July 30th, 2006, 14:12

I tired of people thinking that if DCEmu was to host files such as iso loaders or gameboots, that this site would get shut down. I can't name one PSP site that has been shut down.
Or the idea that "iso loaders kill homebrew so I must hate isos for no particular reason." Homebrew is just as bad for Sony as isos. Both can keep PSP owners from buying more games.

If we start giving into Sony, don't consider this a homebrew site anymore.

BTW, I remember an act that Bill Clinton signed that protects sites with copyrighted material (ie. rom sites,) so I guess it would also apply to DCEmu. But since this site isn't in America, I guess Sony could shut it down.

Voltron

July 30th, 2006, 14:48

I tired of people thinking that if DCEmu was to host files such as iso loaders or gameboots, that this site would get shut down. I can't name one PSP site that has been shut down.

Nicely put! I'm glad this thread appeared. Its good to see that there are lots of people that feel the same as I and are tired of the "I HATE ISO" movement that has been ongoing on this site.

Well, I LOVE ISO's - Take that! I play games I own on UMD in ISO form.

Mr. Shizzy

July 30th, 2006, 16:09

Ahggh, Dude you are so full of **it!
How can you say that downloading Firmwarez is ileagle?!:

O.k. lets get something srtaight before you go misleading alot of ppl.:mad: SONY does own those firmwares. And yes they offer them free for their customers to upgrade with. They do belong to SONY however. Why do you think this sight don't host them? Ask around if you don't believe me. You should reaaly do your homework before you just go shooting off @ the mouth.;) Not only could you mislead ppl, but you make an a$$ of yourself.:(

SSaxdude

July 30th, 2006, 16:12

Well, I LOVE ISO's - Take that! I play games I own on UMD in ISO form.
Me too, load times aggravate me.

FrozenIpaq

July 30th, 2006, 16:30

It's been a while since I've been on DCEmu, but I'm very happy to see such an active community and concerned userbase.

Over at the QJ/PSPU Forums, we did not allow custom gameboot/PMF files due to their legality and it doesn't seem to have caused an uproar of any sort - which I was expecting a few hate PM's, but I got none :)

I never took the situation and looked into it as much, or even had a detailed response as the thread's creator. So, I must say - Great job!

nielsss

July 30th, 2006, 16:39

Me too, load times aggravate me.
yeah man i play iso on my psp, i got 4 on my mem stick right now

Ichijoe

July 30th, 2006, 16:40

While the above is certainly true. I can and will respect
the Rules here, about such things. It's not like dcemu.co.uk is the only psp-hacker Site on the web!

But, that said there are a lot of People here (With some Power it must be said!),
that are just plain Two-Faced about *.iso's!

On the One hand it's ok to pirate NES / SNES / SEGA etc... 'Cause those Systems are dead!
Blah, blah, blah. The last time I looked they were still selling the Gameboy / Advance / Dual Screen.
Yet there's no problem with posting a GBA Emulator.

Allthough I will give the Site credit for not hosting ROMs' (of the above System(s)),.
How much harder is it to use Google to find 'em?!
I didn't ask the Staff here to be my Surrogate Parent(s) nor my Guardian either.
Allthough I must aggree with the Rules here.
I think perhaps your carrying your Nany-State Polices a little to far, though.

Or is it just simply a qusetion of focus?!
Unlike the other "Sites", with the only exception in my Mind beeing Maxconsole.
All the other "Sites" just tend to focus in on the PSP™ exclusivly.

Here it's the PSP™ +Thirteen other Platforms, so whats the deal here exactly?
Given the point of this Thread was about S0NYs'®™ UMD™ Tools.
I'd say that your stance is 100% on the Button.
But, lets take a quick look at the XBOX™, for a second.
Allthough the SDK for that system had been leaked.
I didn't see the system fail, on that count, and the XBMC is the KILLER APP on that Console.
Just ask anyone!

I don't see the harm in *.iso loaders personaly.
Those People who will go to any extent to pirate stuff will do so regardless, of this Site!
This site, whatever it's intensions might be, is instigateing it.
Oh sure it's the NES & Gameboy (for Today lol),.
Till I 'hit' the other "Sites" and learn about Devhook and Torrents.
Then look out!!

Again it's your rules and I'll abide by them.
But are you really doing anyone any favors by sticking your Head(s) in the Sand?!

NOTE: THIS KINDA TALK GETS PEOPLE BANED!
I guess it grates all the Holier-Than-Thu Crowd, 'round these Parts!
Well for a few Hours at most? I wonder what ever happend to that?
BTW. Well here's hopeing I didn't Piss anyone off again this time!! :D lol.

PS: I do not personaly condone the use of Torrents myself!
Allthough I do not have any shame is stateing that, I do in fatct use Dvehook 0.46 Full...

nielsss

July 30th, 2006, 16:45

oh yeah please dcemu don't ban me from talking about iso's ...

Ichijoe

July 30th, 2006, 17:12

O.k. lets get something srtaight before you go misleading alot of ppl.:mad: SONY does own those firmwares. And yes they offer them free for their customers to upgrade with. They do belong to SONY however. Why do you think this sight don't host them? Ask around if you don't believe me. You should reaaly do your homework before you just go shooting off @ the mouth.;) Not only could you mislead ppl, but you make an a$$ of yourself.:(

I don't think that I ever said that S0NY®™ didn't own there Firmwarez, and yes it could be ileagle to host 'em.
But, as far as I know nobody is hosting any unpacked and decrypted Firmwarez.
It's only the EBOOT.PBP that you could have downloaded from S0NY®™.
So I don't see what's so damned ileagl about them!

On the other hand S0NY®™, has every right to get pissy about People posting fully Unpacked and Decrypted Firmwarez.
But, none of the even more moderately enlightened Sites would allow that.
As that would be plainly ileagle!

It may well be there Software, but, It sure as Hell is my PSP™.
It is I and not S0NY Computer Entertainment Europe®™ that gets to decide what or when something lands on my PSP™.

Something for you to chew on!
So why can I not legally hold on to say the last Five S0NY®™ Firmwarez
(2.00, 2.50, 2.60, 2.71 & 2.80), on my own Machine?! (Read: Computer),.
BTW: would it be only fair to mention that I got all these at One time or other from S0NYs' own Servers?!

Answers on a Postcard please!

Illegal Machine

July 30th, 2006, 20:09

Sony can kiss BOTH sides of my a$$.

if you think I'd buy a gallon of orange juice, and then agree to never take it out of the container, you're stupid.

same thing with an ISO. if sony says, I'll SELL you a piece of plastic "UMD" (which the only thing in the universe it works with is a PSP) for 50 bucks, Just DON'T take the content out of the media, I'd say "Hey Sony, You're stupid, I'm gonna do what I want, then post about it"

and if ANYONE thinks I give a damn about Sony, EA games, the related distributors, the retailers, or ANYONE who makes a dollar and a cent in this industry, well YOU'RE stupid too. Because well, I don't

I don't care about the Sony employees.

I don't care about Sony stockholders

I don't care about game develpoers (Ive paid them enough over the years)

I don't care about retailers losses

nothing . and if the PSP dies, well I'll buy a few extra, downgrade them, and keep em around as spares just in case mine breaks.

this is a stupid thread. Piracy is the way to go. to hell with paying... let the Parents of 11 year olds do that for you

NoQuarter

July 30th, 2006, 20:38

NOBODY PAYS=NO MORE DEVELOPMENT
Sony made a really great machine I don't understand why so many people are saying screw you sony

firedragon_jing

July 30th, 2006, 21:16

Ok, I don't know why this is causing such a giant uproar, if you think about it, piracy has been going on for years, and it only puts scratches into the major companies. It's not just in the gaming community, but all software.

That aside, we're complaining about what?, a 2 second video that plays very quick before loading a game of some sort. It's not that big of a deal, infact the PSP Sony logo still displays, so it's not taking away from Sony, it's just removes that ugly splash of color, I rather have something like the PS2 gameboot or even the PSX gameboot.

Now, you can say that the $2000 software used to make these that was leaked is illegal, but you have to realize 3 things. A) This is a beta software without the full features of the one you pay for, you can't even buy this version because it's obsolete. B) This isn't meant for making game movies, this was software for the movie companies to make the UMD Video's with, and as we all know, the UMD Videos are about to die. They're being pulled from store shelves, selling at ridiculously low prices just to get rid of them, and the movie industies have stopped producing these, only ones left are Fox and Sony. They already own it, so the only people they're making real money of this product from are Fox, and once they stop, this software dies. and C) The reason for the high price is along with paying for the software, you're also buying a license to sell the products you make with the software. Now so far, nobody is selling the gameboots they're making, they're just giving them away to people who want them and who are brave enough to flash it to their firmware, and only for that purpose because these pmfs only work on 1.50 PSPs, and won't work with 2.71 Devhook.

Once somebody creates their own software to make pmfs, nobody is going to complain, but until then, people are going to be split on the subject, but I just don't see the big deal seeing the only thing people are using this for is to make a 2 second video that's defiantly not worth $2000, that's $1000 a second, I don't even think Paris Hilton can spend money that fast...

yaustar

July 30th, 2006, 21:42

I don't think that I ever said that S0NY®™ didn't own there Firmwarez, and yes it could be ileagle to host 'em.
But, as far as I know nobody is hosting any unpacked and decrypted Firmwarez.
It's only the EBOOT.PBP that you could have downloaded from S0NY®™.
So I don't see what's so damned ileagl about them!

On the other hand S0NY®™, has every right to get pissy about People posting fully Unpacked and Decrypted Firmwarez.
But, none of the even more moderately enlightened Sites would allow that.
As that would be plainly ileagle!

It may well be there Software, but, It sure as Hell is my PSP™.
It is I and not S0NY Computer Entertainment Europe®™ that gets to decide what or when something lands on my PSP™.

Something for you to chew on!
So why can I not legally hold on to say the last Five S0NY®™ Firmwarez
(2.00, 2.50, 2.60, 2.71 & 2.80), on my own Machine?! (Read: Computer),.
BTW: would it be only fair to mention that I got all these at One time or other from S0NYs' own Servers?!

Answers on a Postcard please!
http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/TermsOfUse

6. This may sound familiar, but it's important, so we're going to rephrase it. Anything on this site--pictures, drawings, text, games, anything--is either our property or the property of someone who gave us the permission to use it. IT'S NOT PUBLIC DOMAIN, AND IT'S DEFINITELY NOT YOURS. Don't use any of it for anything other than personal entertainment, unless we say you can (and we probably won't). If you do, you're probably violating at least one law, and since we told you here, we won't feel bad about coming after you.
You can keep it on your PC but as soon as you distrubute it or host it etc, you are breaking the terms of use.

Mr.Denny

July 30th, 2006, 21:47

Sony should realise, if it wasn`t for these "illegal" gameboots the PSP wouldn`t have as much as a big following even if it is illegal.

I have a 2.6, i download Snes and Megadrive games, i buy PSP games. What harm am i doing?.

yaustar

July 30th, 2006, 21:52

Can you say for the same for the thousands (?) of other homebrew/illegal users of the PSP? I know people who brought the PSP purely for homebrew and haven't bought a single game yet. These users do not bring Sony any profit (as they sell the console at a loss AFAIK).

Remember that we are talking about the collective rather then single users.

NoQuarter

July 30th, 2006, 21:57

If dcemu deosn't wan't to host the gameboots for thier own reasons we should support them, period.I personally don't use any gameboot even the one that came with my firmware-I wen't black and never came back.I'm sure there are plenty of other places to get gameboots if thats your thing.They do make a profit on the psp hardware after a certain point-when production costs have dropped enough.

Mr.Denny

July 30th, 2006, 21:57

True but it`s Sonys fault that these users are drawn to homebrew. I mean let`s face it-Sony hasn`t done the best job with the PSP. They need to give us, me, a reason to update my firware. It must be embarassing to Sony that their users have made better applications than they ever had.

What can i say, i`m not shocked it`s illegal but i`ll continue to download ROMS as well as buy my PSP games.

But that`s just me.

yaustar

July 30th, 2006, 22:05

Mr.Denny

July 30th, 2006, 22:10

But yaustar, can you imagine the percentage that download games?.

I`d say it`s tiny considering you need a PSP 1.5.

If Sony try and pin the PSPs failure down on it`s users they`ll be foolish.

GeEkPiE

July 30th, 2006, 22:19

not wise to use custom gameboots, i used one in Xflash and my precious 1.5 is now bricked coz the screen freezes before you try to play any form of media

Mr.Denny

July 30th, 2006, 22:23

I use eloader. Pretty safe so far.

IndianCheese

July 30th, 2006, 22:26

Crap. They shut down my custom gameboot thread.

And GeekPie, did you have custom firmware installed? If so, start up your PSP with the HOLD switch down.

Ichijoe

July 30th, 2006, 22:26

Now so far, nobody is selling the gameboots they're making, they're just giving them away to people who want them and who are brave enough to flash it to their firmware, and only for that purpose because these pmfs only work on 1.50 PSPs, and won't work with 2.71 Devhook.

Well you're wong there Mate!
I have no problems useing the Claw Slash *.pms (or whatever it's called), on my v1.50, though Devhook 0.46 W/Firmware v2.71.
Perhaps you didn't install it correctly you do have to rename the new File to match the One you'll latter delete inside ms0:/dh/2.xx/flash0/vsh/resource/

Atlest that's what works for me...

dtothabreezy

July 30th, 2006, 22:32

i still dont get the huff and puff about this there gameboots but dcemu has never stered me rong so i respect there descion

pkmaximum

July 30th, 2006, 22:38

No matter what people the web master of this site wich is Wraggster can do what ever he wants with it. That is like saying if you own a house and others come over and they don't like the idea you don't have a indoor swimming pool, you have to get one! Come on people this is his site and we have no right to debate on him to change it. He is trying to do in his interstest that is best for the community (us) and still keep on a legal scene. Does this mean I agree with everything that is done on this site?

A: Of course not!

Why is it that any discussion about ISO's is prohibited but a system that is still distributing by Nintendo GBA is completeley legal to talk about. Now I bet if we go to the GBA scene in the dcemu section that any talk about pirating GBA games is prohibeted. Its like saying WTF! This is retarted. But no matter how much these rules don't make sense its always in Wraggsters decision to choose on what he likes to be hosted on his site. After all we are not forced to come here, and we can freely go to any other PSP site as we please. Please don't try to make people do things they don't wish to do.

P.S. Wraggster and all the forum moderators are great but I do believe that a bit of revision on what is discussed here should be fixed.

NoQuarter

July 30th, 2006, 22:45

yaustar

July 30th, 2006, 23:07

Yes yaustar I believe I have seen sony's game division losses somewhere around 2billion,question is where did they lose the money it certainly wasn't on the psp production alone.Most likely alot is from ps3 R&D but I will research this a little more thouroughly.By the way I payed for several umds but also use homebrew, all of this is becoming a little grey.
Again, I am referring to EVERYONE that has a PSP, not just one or two individuals. Sony's losses of the games division can be due to any number of things and piracy on the PSP *could* be one of them. It is certainly not helping the matter.

firedragon_jing

July 30th, 2006, 23:12

Well you're wong there Mate!
I have no problems useing the Claw Slash *.pms (or whatever it's called), on my v1.50, though Devhook 0.46 W/Firmware v2.71.
Perhaps you didn't install it correctly you do have to rename the new File to match the One you'll latter delete inside ms0:/dh/2.xx/flash0/vsh/resource/

Atlest that's what works for me...The Claw Slash is not a custom gameboot, but rather a ripped pmf from a UMD Game, and those have been written to support all firmware, meaning they'll work on 2.71, but I'm talking about the custom gameboots that this thread is complaining about that the average person makes with the leaked UMD Tools, that are unsigned but can run on 1.50 because of the lack of security. Now, they'll work on 1.50 emulated devhook.

NoQuarter

July 30th, 2006, 23:12

I agree yaustar, piracy is definetly hurting the psp.Do you consider using emulators and old roms piracy though?Who knows maybe everybody who downloaded umd tools got a free rootkit as a bonus!

yaustar

July 30th, 2006, 23:45

Do you consider using emulators and old roms piracy though?
Legally, yes it is against the law. Morally, it sits on the line as long as the games 'pirated' cannot be brought or obtained in a way that developers get income from.

NoQuarter

July 31st, 2006, 01:19

I agreee with you on that.Ibought my psp for commercial games but have been in heaven since I found out about the emu's.I used to not care about piracy but now that has all changed,I'd hate to see my beloved system die because people don't want to pay for their games.Whats so great about custom gameboots that people would want to steal $2000 software for it and possibly cause problems for such a great site like dcemu?Can't they just get their gameboots from the same place they got the umd tools?

F9zDark

July 31st, 2006, 01:46

As some may recall, I was a proponent of legal ISOs, which is the purchaser of a game making a backup copy under the stipulations of the Fair Use law.

Many people have apparently gotten pissed off with this thread and have voiced their concerns. Well that is fine, and I defend your right to do so. But if you don't like the rules that the powers that be instilled here, then leave.

I cannot name any sites that Sony has personally shut down, but I know of a site where a business moved in and not only got the site shut down, but took over the owner's PAID FOR webhosting. Funny thing is, the the business that did that, went under, and the original owner was able to reclaim his domain and webhost.

This act was done out of pure malice (the business 'claimed they had a reason, the site made a joke 'store front' and this business liked that name and decided to take it for themselves, without ever having thought it of themselves).

The point of this story? If a mid-sized business, could at whim, decide to shut down a site without a truthful claim, then what could Sony do? Sony doesn't like homebrew on the PSP. Period. They have also suffered major losses in their game division. Which they have probably attributed to PSP homebrew/piracy. Why buy games when you can have tons of fun playing emulators and homebrew games?

How much longer until Sony becomes desperate and decides to wage a large scale war against homebrew on the PSP? With everything that has worked against them this past year, I am truly surprised that they haven't done more to stop homebrew as it is...

NoQuarter

July 31st, 2006, 02:15

Well said f9zdark,I don't think any of us want the legal wrath of sony to end the homebrew scene.Until the business models of corporations like sony change we need to play by the rules.

jwilds73

July 31st, 2006, 02:45

Legally, yes it is against the law. Morally, it sits on the line as long as the games 'pirated' cannot be brought or obtained in a way that developers get income from.

Well that isn't completely true. While you can not go to the local video game store and purchase a new copy of Metal Slug and it's followup releases for the Neo Geo. You can still purchase the PS2 collection and the soon to be released PSP collection. If you instead pirated these games from previous system releases like the Neo Geo and haven't purchased the rereleased versions your keeping money out of their pockets. Same apply's to tons of "collection's" such as Street Fighter series etc. These companies are still releasing this products in other format's which we could purchase.

yaustar

July 31st, 2006, 03:26

Reread my post:
Morally, it sits on the line as long as the games 'pirated' cannot be brought or obtained in a way that developers get income from.In your case with Metal Slug etc, the games can still be brought in a way that the developers still get income therefore it is morally wrong hence the "as long" part.

pkmaximum

July 31st, 2006, 06:59

In Poland their are no copy right laws, If I even get caught I'll book it straight to there =P

Dam United States and their dam laws!!!

mcvader

July 31st, 2006, 08:55

I don't see how in the hell sony could be losing money! They've won the console wars for the last two generations by a mile, if sony are losing that much money nintendo (not to mention microsoft) must owe billions! but to say that piracy isn't hurting the psp is nonsence, look what happened to sega, the psp is so easy to use illegaly that most people with a psp would be aware of image loaders and the like, I wouldn't be suprised if the % of people using the psp illegaly would be A LOT higher than 0.03%. as far as these illegal gameboots go i couldn't care less about them and wouldn't bother downloading them if they were legal.

DimensionT

August 1st, 2006, 00:39

I completely agree that there shouldn't be any talk of ISOs in the forums (let those pirate *******s go somewhere else), and I feel the same about illegal gameboots... But the firm stance angainst Dev Hook and such seems some what hypocritical to me.

Seriously now, what's the difference between linking to Dev Hook and linking to new versions of the Supercard software for the DS? Both allow you to pirate games with the same amount of ease. Dev Hook actualy seems more legal to me, as it lets you play new games off the UMD on older firmware. Supercard software on the other hand, has no use other then making commercial ROMs work (aside from some homebrew GBA games that need patching).