Homebrew a true utopian society?

[shadowprophet]

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/8127/psphack250bk1.jpg


Firstly forgive the rather startling picture, It seemed to fit the point of this article, Do read on.



Homebrew.. the very word for some brings about thoughts of your favorite game,program, or application, The scene has grown so much in the last few years. It truly is a wonderful time to own your favorite console, So many talented developers, So much to choose from, and all for the cost of absolutely nothing, These talented people, create there works of wonder for little more then recognition of there talent. Its true, the homebrew scene has become so vast, its now a very competitive field to develop for. So many talented developers with all that competition only breads more creative intellectual properties, only making the scene better for everyone.

How is all this possible? How can such a great thing happen. and cost nothing?! well the truth is. In many respects, It does cost something, Those talented developers work tirelessly pulling down long hours, toiling away to creating something wonderful, there labor pays this cost for everyone. And then they turn around and give us there creations, there (magnum opus) if you will, Its a shining example of how strong and how loved the homebrew scene really is. And we give them in return, praise and support, and well wishes. it fuels them, our hopes and ideas, help them gather the strength to continue there endeavors, and often they return with something even more amazing, down the road.

Yes its true even you and I play our part in this scene too. our thoughts and opinions, Our praise and support. believe me these well wishes are much appreciated from our hard working devs.

In fact the homebrew scene would be a shining example of a true utopian society, In many ways it already is.

But the truth is There is a dark side to the homebrew scene as well. This dark side of the scene prevents us from reaching our perfect goal. It plagues us with setbacks, and scares of legal issues, in fact forcing many talented developers to leave the scene out of fear of legal retribution.

That's right. Im talking about Software piracy, Warez, ISO'S, what many people don't understand, Is there is a fine line drawn between our homebrew scene, and software piracy.

while our homebrew scene is frowned upon by corporation console developers. We protect our scene by keeping it legal, Meaning that every piece of homebrew we serve is completely (Homemade) without a trace of commercial intellectual property contained within.

however that line between homebrew and commercial software is becoming finer every day, as homebrew developers become more talented, we are now seeing commercial quality, completely legal homebrew more and more.

But there is a dark side to our scene too. Call it lack of creativity, or just laziness. But some Developers have now saw fit to use bits and pieces of commercial property in there projects, make no mistake this is an illegal move, And damaging beyond words to our scene..

From fragments of commercial property found in our homebrew. to Iso loaders, Make no mistake our scene is under the microscope. Big corporations would love for our scene to just dry up and go away, it would force more people to buy commercial software as inflated prices.

The proof is out there, Sony discovered commercial software imbedded in a certain firmware emulation application and issued a cease and desist order to its respective developer.

Make no mistake. They would love to (end) our scene.

People must be aware if they could legally end our scene they would have, But by keeping the scene legal we keep homebrew safe for everyone!

Imagine a world without homebrew... Its hard to imagine isn't it? we have become so attached to the idea of just downloading our latest favorite apps and games and playing them for free, that its almost impossible to imagine going back to a time without this awesome scene.

realize that things like iso loaders that load commercial software do a lot more then encourage one to download illegal warez (stolen commercial property) They damage our scene buy putting us in the hot seat. all that needs to be done to shut any site down is some mistake to be caught under that micro scope and a cease and desist order from some corporation and poof, the scene is no more..

So keep in mind the next time you see or hear about a piece of warez. take these things into account. warez is commercial software that has been stolen, leaked or copied, realize that even though it may seem harmless. that by downloading and playing it you put you self at risk too. make no mistake (it is theft). and if your caught, they wont just fine you the price of the game itself. they will fine you according the the copyright laws under which it is protected. (believe me its a very stiff fine)

And that is just on individual accounts, Servers and networks get fined individually for each piece of copyrighted material that is found on there servers. Its no wonder warez servers are always going down...

In closing I would like to say, I wrote this article to wake people up. Not that everyone needs wakening up. We have many good honest people in this scene. But there are still those out there who would cheat our scene and harm us, by seeking or distributing stolen commercial property.
And in the long run they cheat more then the scene, they cheat there selves... By damaging a scene you love your only hurting yourself..

Thoughts opinions.

Leave Feedback Via Comments Below

[QueadlunnRau]

Are you feeling alright? Everyones mood is changing in this scene ...

What ever happened to the up beat DCEmu that I came to grow and love? Can this crew ever go back to the innocent days of looking forward to what new homebrew was coming out next?

Seems these past weeks have been devoted to worry of what might come of the homebrew scene, or worry of what Sony might do to it. C'Mon can we ever go back to just looking for new and innovative homebrew?

I personally don't touch any software/homebrew outside this site, don't have a need too.

[Gene]

not gonna quote because its long but, Well said my brother, well said.

[jOeBrO]

not gonna quote because its long but, Well said my brother, well said.

yes VERY well said, i hope this wakes people up

it would be a shame if a site as great as this gets shut down because of part of their own community(ISO downloaders)

[kando]

very well written and insightful article :)

[NoQuarter]

Yeah, well said man!I'm sure we all want the scene to continue,just some people think their actions don't have any repercussions.I fully stand by Dcemu's position on warez.

[xiringu]

I think there's something wrong in what you say, and it is that homebrew/open source can't be stopped. that's it, exactly how it sounds.

it doesn't matter if it is legal or not. it's just too big for anyone to stop it.

of course, they can make it difficult. let's say...don't let homebrew run on their hardware. oh! they've already done it! and they failed... :)

of course, they can sue somebody (one person) for something illegal, but they can't stop a mass of people doing this. if somebody get's sued, the next project could be released with no names so nobody gets to be blamed.

and there's one big thing helping homebrew: technology is advancing fast and powerful handhelds or umpcs or even mobile phones will reach soon the 1Ghz (give it 1 or 2 years)

that's the reality. and that's a bright future for us. we will be able to run homebrew on anything, even something tiny like a mobile phone.

and all those gadgets will be powerful enough to run a full version of windows or linux, so the huuuuge amount of software that already exists will be usable on our portables.

there will be no more porting of software to DS, psp, or gp2x, because they will be able to run a full OS :)

piracy you say? there's piracy on desktops and I don't see the market tumbling or disappearing because of that

it's just a matter of time that open source and homebrew will be on top of anything else, and nobody can stop this.


I've been using computers for 17 years, owned lots of them and you know what? there were lots of people saying the same things you say about 10 years ago, and they were all wrong. :)

to put an example:
I even got to try a beta version of the very first Windows, well before it was made commercial, on my university days and I don't see Microsoft ruined by that.

the scene will just grow, and grow, and grow...

[NoQuarter]

Your right, probably nothing can stop homebrew and open source,I just don't want my favorite website to go down over something stupid

[xiringu]

yes, that's a total different thing.

stay on the legal side to avoid problems :)

[ACID]

Thats right as long as roms and isos are not been promoted they cant tell you guys that you are wrong . Great article shadow.

[shinysuitman]

Utopia is a myth like the lock-ness monster or a girlfriend that doesnt suck money... anywho, its sad to say that while it does cause the inevitable instance of sending the psp homebrew scene into underground. like yin and yang, every scene will have its downside. learn to use the scene for what you want while its like you want it and hope for the best

[the one and only]

nice article, shadowprophet

[DrNicket]

In my opinion, a truly Utopian society would be where every essential is provided free of charge. Anything above that would be acquired/accomplished via a form of the barter system. Services for services mostly.

I believe that society started out with barter and developed a barter pool where each put in and each could take out, but where the trouble likely began is too many people were either taking out too much or not enough were putting in. Supply no longer met demand. So money came along to keep track of it all and show who had what worth... promissary notes in lieu of genuine product or service. What caused that? Greed. As long as greed gets the better of the majority of us... we'll never grow out of the need for money.

Homebrew is a fine example of Barter (albeit a simple and somewhat lopsided example). The Devs create a game and give it freely, and the community gives/pays back in the form of compliments and constructive criticism. The bad/lopside, being the sad and pathetic flames at developers that "aren't fast enough" or don't accomplish miraculous feats in the space it takes to change a tire or any of a numerous list of dumb reasons to put down a hardworking dev for no reason but to put them down. The only reason Sony or any other company would have any reason to complain about the homebrew scene is the hit to the wallet the illegal homebrew activity produces.

I'll admit I'm no angel, but I believe in a fair and just world. I've downloaded music I didn't own, but I treated them like a demo. I either bought the CD shortly thereafter or deleted the related files. There were times where I could not afford to buy, so I saved up and bought anyway... just later. The only exception being where there was no commercial (or earthly available; moratorium, etc.) release and no way of me paying for the product (rather gray I know). I currently own over 300 DVDs, every one of them legally mine (given that I only own the material it's on and not the original rights to the films). I either paid, won or was given every single one of those discs. My main reason for coming back to DCEmu was ZX-81. He ported my favorite homebrew: PSPInt: Intellivision Emulator for PSP. I own 3 (or more) Intellivisions and at least one of every official commercial accessory and almost all of the official and 3rd party games (I haven't gone through them all and compared them to a checklist yet). The only thing I lack is the ability to acquire my ROMs directly from my cartridges (I would if I could, but I still need to learn how). Then I would be 100% legal with Intellivision emulation (as far as I know anyway).

Some people trash Metallica for being so hard against music downloads... but listen... Aren't/Weren't they one of the bands that encourage/supported bootleg recording of live performances? They just didn't/don't condone piracy of commercial releases. They understand that not everyone could see every concert even if money and time were no object. So, 'let the world hear our unique sound at this event'. When most anyone with $20 (ballpark) can buy a particular CD nearly anywhere, only restricted by the number of available CDs, there's no reason to steal it.

Shadowprophet, I salute you.

[NoQuarter]

I guess we're gonna be stuck in this grey area until open source turns the tide and make copyright laws obselete.It makes no since countries outwardly oppose monopolies but yet they'll issue a patent or copyright on intellectual property which has the potential to ensure a monopoly.Really we need the coporations to change their business models.Competition is good and market control is bad.I wonder if metallica still maintains the same stance on bootlegging at their concerts.Market control is one the reasons we still use oil:mad:

[PSPdemon]

Hmmm.... i have to thought of this to shades...

It hurts to see people do things they know that are wrong.....and continue doing them.....( yall might say... how can only 1 person hurt the company by downloading the iso's.... well...it can.... )

also.... after my own problem with a company ( microsoft...wont go any further ).... i decided that after all these games i have worked on that take ideas from others........after i read this article...i am going to make games that are of my own ideas.....and no longer make games that are from someone elses ideas.... i think its better anyway to have something unique than to have somthing that is taken from another....

another thing is.....that with all these people making iso loaders.... its just hurting the scene more than helping it....

and as you said


In closing I would like to say, I wrote this article to wake people up. Not that everyone needs wakening up. We have many good honest people in this scene. But there are still those out there who would cheat our scene and harm us, by seeking or distributing stolen commercial property.
And in the long run they cheat more then the scene, they cheat there selves... By damaging a scene you love your only hurting yourself..


I think you may have awakened in me a start to a couple of projects i have on paper....that i might make into games :D

anyway,

Thanks Shades,
PSPdemon

[NoQuarter]

The fact that this scene has gotten so big is a move in the right direction.It's us the internet users that are moving things toward a true free market.props to you pspdemon I admire your attitude,but isn't their a difference between homage and piracy

[shadowprophet]

The fact that this scene has gotten so big is a move in the right direction.It's us the internet users that are moving things toward a true free market.props to you pspdemon I admire your attitude,but isn't their a difference between homage and piracy
But see this is where the fine line comes in.
Some people,(unaware that it was even illegal)
Will take sprites and music and artifacts, that where ripped straight from commercial property..

I myself didn't know that was illegal until recently,
Its an issue that hasn't been widely publicized. So how are people expected to know..

But that's where the fine line is drawn.
And that fine line itself is confusingly thin, The difference between software piracy and fan ware. is almost indistinguishable at times. and copy right laws can be confusing.

But the real true golden rule of homebrew is. Any piece of homebrew must be completely homemade ,, be it art music textures special effects. that's not to say that one person has to make the entire thing, there are many many legal fan reproductions of music and art that may legally be used to claim the title (fan ware) which is perfectly legal. :)

[Pico]

while our homebrew scene is frowned upon by corporation console developers. We protect our scene by keeping it legal, Meaning that every piece of homebrew we serve is completely (Homemade) without a trace of commercial intellectual property contained within.


Well thats an outright lie, you (shadowprophet) regulary post news about that dude who mods turrican and im pretty sure he dont hold any copyrights stateing he owns the franchise or has any permission from who holds the copyright for use of turrican in any way. But look at the games section on psp news any you'll see plenty more examples of this, best example's include psp milionaire, super turbo turky puncher (from doom3), Super Mini Mario, Super Mini Sonic, Bomberman Arena (you can get a few psp bomberman games on import), Bejeweled (it's been removed but not due to DCEmu's high moral standard of what legal hombrew is, but by the people who made it
Today ive been informed by Kojote that he and the Bejeweled coder The Grey Matter were sent emails asking for the game to be taken down.

It seems that the owners of the Bejeweled game are to release a PSP version of the game and that by using the name Bejeweled it will harm sales of the game, also the homebrew game uses ripped graphics and they will need to be took off future releases of the homebrew game if renamed.

Discuss this news here
Sadly the last example realy happend but at the time i cant remember anyone calling them lazy, talentless thiefs for stealing part's of a game and the game as well. And then there the unofficial sdk, while im no expert on what its compiled of i'll bet it contains libarys that could be be deemed commercial intellectual property (Microsoft shut down a xbox port of mame because it contained some xbox only libarys). The sad thing is if you ask for permission to use content such as old games not available via retail anymore or a game character (they can count as trademarks as well, and most spirte rips are right out). Intellectual property rights last a long time so stealing people's property from "original" work's should be frowned upon, but its not and as a consequence people make attempt to work on a port of some GBA emu and get praised for there work. As far i know GBA's are still a big seller commercialy, but here there's no opposition to making a GBA emu that will exclusively be used for playing "warez" for no good reason, also how often have you seen gba game's outselling psp game's. The one good thing you could say about umd iso's pirates is that they got a spine based on the fact they blatently just steal a game (well would they have brought a game they downloaded anyway,proberly not and that means no lost sales), unlike all the uber moral "Legal homebrewer's" who just steal content and claim it as there own almost.

Good topic by the way :D

[PSPdemon]

there is a diference between it........

some people choose to accept it....and some people choose to think of it as a cheap way out......

piracy has been the closing point for all console's....with homebrew that is.... and it just seem like people dont want to think of originality anymore or uniqueness qualities.... they just think that if they "improvise" on a already out game...it will be a hit.... but the thing is....."i have seen it, i have done it....and i want to do somthing new"

i paid homage to halo.....but at the same time i was crossing there ip....

we arnt all made to be perfect angles....we all have done somthing bad....we cant change the past....but we can change the future....

if we make umd emulation that doesnt do ISO's... and if we stop crossing the line with making games like "Starcraft Lua" and such where the sprites and tiles are all ripped from the accual games....we might get somewhere where people will stop...

its an idealest dream.....but its what i wish for...

this is why i am glad to be a part of dcemu.....they try to set a equal opporunity for everyone...and also make sure that nothing illegal or harmful to the scene is brought out...

also....dcemu has nice members who dont go flaming people and bring down coders who are trying there best at bring free games.....

Many things i have wondered....like "whats gonna happen to the homebrew scene" and "will the company's really close down homebrew scenes because of its actions to use loaders and illegal use of material?"

i know that i maybe just spitting out words and rambling on like an old man.... :D but i hate to see such great things go down because of illegal homebrew that promote illegal use...

anyway....

Thanks to Everyone
PSPdemon

( PS - its really late.....sorry for anything that doesnt make sense :D )

[ExcruciationX]

Very well written article, shadowprophet! It's not saying that the homebrew scene will die soon, it's just saying, that if we post the ISO version of Device Hook here, we could get shutdown.

[Kramer]

i dont see how ripping a few sprites could hurt a company.
all these rich ass companies have enough money allready so they should stop being bitches

[shadowprophet]

Well thats an outright lie, you (shadowprophet) regulary post news about that dude who mods turrican and im pretty sure he dont hold any copyrights stateing he owns the franchise or has any permission from who holds the copyright for use of turrican in any way.

You have to understand, this particular copyright issue was just recently brought to light,
You also have to take into account, that none of us staff are certified legal technicians. we do our best, and even still some things will slip through the cracks. We simply don't have the time, to disassemble and examine every piece of homebrew that comes our way, But I assure you.
When something illegal is discovered it is put into evaluation, until it is either cleared or removed.
You have to also consider that you are getting your legal issues crossed here most if the issues you are talking about fall into the fan ware category, (fan recreations of art sprites that someone created there selves)- it is not illegal to use those. provided the user had permission form there creator. while its true. that certain art and music have slipped by us, that where commercial property, since then a strict new policy has taken effect. while we fell it unnecessary to evaluate every piece of homebrew we have, when we do discover something illegal that has slipped through the cracks it will generally disappear rather quickly.

[PSPdemon]

i dont see how ripping a few sprites could hurt a company.
all these rich ass companies have enough money allready so they should stop being bitches

okay.....let me give you an example

if you worked on a game sprite.....that you would have worked on for 2 months to perfect....and then you would see someone else make a game with your sprites and not give you credit.....wouldnt you pe pissed as well...

i would....

its like when i tried to make halo on the psp..... it was me making a game look like halo.......think about it...you would be a xbox user and would walk into a panera....you would see someone with a psp and would ask "hey, what ya playin" and they would show you a halo game on the psp..... now.....xbox hasnt moved onto the portable side of things and people would love to be able to play on the go....and then people would want to get a psp to try it out as well

meaning.... more sales on the psp.....less sales on the xbox...

thats why......we need to try to develop new and unique types of homebrew.....

everytime i see a new and inventive homebrew piece come out......it seems to be better than anything else.....

a good example is crystalise.......that game had a unique gameplay and was really addictive... and it was made from a thought.......

anyway,

Thanks Again,

PSPdemon

[PSPdemon]

You have to understand, this particular copyright issue was just recently brought to light,
You also have to take into account, that none of us staff are certified legal technicians. we do our best, and even still some things will slip through the cracks. We simply don't have the time, to disassemble and examine every piece of homebrew that comes our way, But I assure you.
When something illegal is discovered it is put into evaluation, until it is either cleared or removed.
You have to also consider that you are getting your legal issues crossed here most if the issues you are talking about fall into the fan ware category, (fan recreations of art sprites that someone created there selves)- it is not illegal to use those. provided the user had permission form there creator. while its true. that certain art and music have slipped by us, that where commercial property, since then a strict new policy has taken effect. while we fell it unnecessary to evaluate every piece of homebrew we have, when we do discover something illegal that has slipped through the cracks it will generally disappear rather quickly.

rather a good point shades....

we try our best to make sure that nothing illegal slips though into dcemu...... but between moderation and looking thorugh homebrew.....its a hard task to bear......we might not catch onto it right away....but we do reasure that if somthing is "slipped thorugh the cracks" it will be taken off the site asap....

anyway.....nice going shades :D

Thanks for Everything,
PSPdemon

[NoQuarter]

It seems pretty obvious that we all just need more open source and original input and no longer rely on an already existing franchise.By making our own stuff open source we clear the way for future developers not to have these problems. GPL anyone?Maybe everything here should be required to be licensed under GPL or something similar.

[Voltron]

I have good in me, but I'm drawn to the DARK....

The PSP homebrew scene is great. Nothing better. I love and support PSP homebrew all the way. It has been an amazing time lately for PSP homebrew. With that being said, I will NOT give up the Dark Side of homebrew. I am all for the FULL version of DevHook and ISO Loading and will never stop.

Yes, I download ISO's. But mostly I do this to get games that are released first in Japan. Games like Bomberman Portable & Ultimate Ghosts 'N Goblins that I just cannot wait for. Instead of paying a hefty import price, I will do this but I will also buy the game when it is released in the U.S. No need for me to buy the game twice so I don't see any harm in what I do.

There are some issues I need to take up with this article and idea that the Dark Side of homebrew is threatening its vitality.

1.) GBA -- The GBA is not dead and is still selling a lot of commercial units and games. But there is no outcry over a GBA EMU that plays GBA ROMS. In fact its one of the most supported works of homebrew on the PSP.

2.) PSOne EMU -- Everyone wants a true "homebrew" PSOne EMU to be made to allow us to play FREE PSOne ISO's. This will no doubt undermine Sony's financial gain from their official PSOne EMU and game download service. Sooooo, copyrighted PSOne ISO's are fair game but PSP ISO's are taboo?

Given these 2 expamples, is it just me or is something wrong with this hypcrtitical throught process? Yes, I've been fed the usual line from MODs stating that ROMS don't directly relate to the PSP so it is not fair to comprare ROMS to PSP ISO's. That is weakest argument I've ever heard. ROMs, ISO's, either way, not much difference.

I think many in the PSP scene need to lighten up and stop worrying about fabled legal problems or the PSP being killed. Look at the vast amount of great titles set to be released over the next 2-3 months for the PSP. The PSP is not being killed off by piracy.

::IN CLOSING::

I am in favor of Sony's PSOne EMU and have no problem paying a reasonable fee for downloadable PSOne games. I really want Sony to succeed on this one. I truly believe that a "homebrew" PSOne EMU will cause Sony more damage than PSP ISO's.

LIGHTEN UP EVERYONE! STOP CONCENTRATING ON THE NEGATIVE!!!

No matter what, PSP ISO loading is not going anywhere. You either support it or you don't but I want people to stop trying to separate GOOD homebrew users from BAD homebrew users to create some sort of divide. Labeling us all Pirates is not fair and we all need to be united.

[NoQuarter]

I really don't want to pay sony for games I have already paid for.No need to pay for a game twice.;)Does this fall under the fair use laws?Seems to me it would.Look we all fall into the grey area and should not pass judgement on each other,but Dcemu needs to be protected as much as possible.I don't know about you guys but I REALLY don't like most other psp forums, the people are extremely rude!

[groovemaster303]

to be honest the best thing about the psp is its emulators and stuff from Snes TYL to Capcom CPS1/2. i sure most people will agree that many of the psp's official games are lackluster ports or just have unimpressive gameplay.
but Sony being sony they view everything nasty and horrible will stop at nothing to destroy the homebrew scene.
Iso loaders are bad for various reasons but nobody will stop using them.
this is looking like it could turn into a very nasty time for the HB scene.

[compoman386]

You have to understand, this particular copyright issue was just recently brought to light

Yes, but surely you have been aware before now that roms are, no matter what you think on a moral level, illegal. One of the most popular things in psp homebrew right now is emulators, and this site has links to a ton of them, do people really believe that people are only using them for public domain roms? Or just roms of games they already own? Especially when every time you post news of the realese of a new emu, at least one of the screenshots will be of a commercial game in action.

Im not saying it's wrong, but legal it ain't

[Mystic8277]

So are you saying that piracy and using copyrighted code kills console's?

[shadowprophet]

Yes, but surely you have been aware before now that roms are, no matter what you think on a moral level, illegal. One of the most popular things in psp homebrew right now is emulators, and this site has links to a ton of them, do people really believe that people are only using them for public domain roms? Or just roms of games they already own? Especially when every time you post news of the realese of a new emu, at least one of the screenshots will be of a commercial game in action.

Im not saying it's wrong, but legal it ain't
The thing is this, Emulators are created with the idea that public domain roms can be played in them. Homebrew. The idea here is homebrew, And since these emulators are created legally with perfectly legal intent. There is no cause for alarm in emulators..
They are created to simulate a consoles working environment so homebrew can be made in an environment similar to that of (said console) Its a legal hobby. with legal intentions. Nothing more,
Dcemu however doesn't link to commercial roms and never will for that matter, We simply don't support software piracy. An example of this would be the standing rule we have about members asking for roms, if they don't enjoy the roms we serve, then its there job and there own business to find and play what they wish in them. all we do is create legal emulators, and homebrew and apps. nothing more

This is how and why it is safe and legal for us to server emulators, We don't serve commercial roms and we certainly don't support the idea of downloading and playing, them. people that do this, do it at there own digression, period :cool:

And to Mystic8277. Simply put what I am saying is software piracy and using copyrighted code hurts the homebrew scene. and it very well does.

[Mystic8277]

And to Mystic8277. Simply put what I am saying is software piracy and using copyrighted code hurts the homebrew scene. and it very well does.
What about the entire Xbox scene then? Nearly all the homebrew is compiled using the Xbox SDK, which you can't get (legally) unless you are a developer.

[shadowprophet]

What about the entire Xbox scene then? Nearly all the homebrew is compiled using the Xbox SDK, which you can't get (legally) unless you are a developer.
I can assure you completely. I believe your mistaken about that.. A Dev kit would be like the special (expensive kit that company's use to make software for the X-box) Believe me you misunderstand the concept of exploited in this case, The X-box was exploited Via hardmod (modchip) or softmod (Software exploit).. Meaning that you no longer need the x-box skd to write code for it as the exploit made it open source, Again I assure you that we keep our scene perfectly legal :)

[Mystic8277]

I can assure you completely. I believe your mistaken about that.. A Dev kit would be like the special (expensive kit that company's use to make software for the X-box) Believe me you misunderstand the concept of exploited in this case, The X-box was exploited Via hardmod (modchip) or softmod (Software exploit).. Meaning that you no longer need the x-box skd to write code for it as the exploit made it open source, Again I assure you that we keep our scene perfectly legal :)
No, the Xbox SDK is software you install on your computer along with MS Visual Studio .NET.. I know because I compile Xbox Media Center from source. The only alternative to Microsoft's kit is OpenXDK and that's still in early stages.

[shadowprophet]

No, the Xbox SDK is software you install on your computer along with MS Visual Studio .NET.. I know because I compile Xbox Media Center from source.

Are you sure you dont mean the X-box tool chain?
In any case. Are you absolutly cartain, its the offical microsoft X-box tool chain being used in these developments?

[Mystic8277]

Are you sure you dont mean the X-box tool chain?
In any case. Are you absolutly cartain, its the offical microsoft X-box tool chain being used in these developments?
I'm not sure if it's also called Xbox tool chain but if you go on http://www.xbox-scene.com/ you'll notice most posts say "Download: n/a (built with XDK)" at the bottom. There is only a couple programs that I know of that are built with the OpenXDK.

[Voltron]

I really don't want to pay sony for games I have already paid for.No need to pay for a game twice.;)

Totally understandable. The thing I think people should consider is that if Sony is going to take this on and expect to be PAID, they better do it right with much benefits and convenience.

1.) Compatibilty should be excellent. Games should work perfect and perform great.

2.) File size will likely be very small. Sony may make the games eBoot files. The games will not be in ISO form. Sony knows that memory stick sizes are small so however the games are for the PSP, I bet Sony will find a way to make sizes EXTREMELY small.

3.) Compatibility with PS3. If you can download and store PSOne games to the PS3 and stream them to the PSP, that would be another plus.

4.) Convenience. Playing with ISO's can be a hassle. You need to rip the game, rebuild, patch, compress, etc. etc. I'd gladly pay $5.00 or $10.00 for some great PSOne games and avoid the hassle.

With all that said, I may regret these words. I am all for the homebrew PSOne EMU and hope that it becomes a reality and becomes really great.

Another thing is that I plan to keep my PSP at 1.50 firmware and if DevHook cannot emulate the "official" PSOne EMU, I may have no choice but to use a homebrew PSOne EMU.

[SmashinGit]

Unfortunately the only reason why the Xbox has so many great emulators is that the vast majority of them are written using the stolen Xbox sdk code. Thats why you'll never find any links to them on most sites. That is also why if homebrew or emulators were ever to come on 360 they probably wouldn't be as good as the original Xbox.

Getting back to the psp. I still find it amazing that I have had my psp since practically day one of it being launched in Japan. To this day I only have two commercial games, Ridge Racer and Locoroco. No other commercial games have got me the slightest bit interested. Releasing versions of Tekken, Fifa and the constant stream of yearly updates is not what I bought my psp for. I bought my psp to play original, high quality games and unfortunately the software companies are not supplying me with the games I want. I've recently gone and bought a DS because of this. If the software companies were to release some original games instead of the constant trash that has been coming out I would not have a problem in updating. If it wasn't for the excellent homebrew scene my psp would of gotton shelved or sold ages ago.

[shadowprophet]

I'm not sure if it's also called Xbox tool chain but if you go on http://www.xbox-scene.com/ you'll notice most posts say "Download: n/a (built with XDK)" at the bottom. There is only a couple programs that I know of that are built with the OpenXDK.

To be honest, I don't know if this is something that has been brought up to the administration or not. Before I look further into this. I want you to compile me a short list, you don't have to get them all, just a few piece of homebrew two or three will be fine. Or programs that you believe have been compiled with this illegal tool chain, Just post them here, And I will bring this before the administration. for review, Its all i can do at the moment. Like i said before sometimes, things slip through the cracks,

But your right this does deserve looking into..

[Mystic8277]

To be honest, I don't know if this is something that has been brought up to the administration or not. Before I look further into this. I want you to compile me a shot list, you don't have to get them all, just a few piece of homebrew. Or programs that you believe have been compiled with this illegal tool chain, Just post them here, And I will bring this before the administratioê. for review, Its all i can do at the moment. Like i said before sometimes, things slip through the cracks,

But your right this does deserve looking into..
I wasn't talking about http://xbox-emulation.dcemu.co.uk/ Sorry if
I confused you, I was just talking about the xbox homebrew scene in general how the programs are compiled with the MS XDK. I guess I got a little off topic.

[shadowprophet]

I wasn't talking about http://xbox-emulation.dcemu.co.uk/ Sorry if
I confused you, I was just talking about the xbox homebrew scene in general how the programs are compiled with the MS XDK. I guess I got a little off topic.
Ahh, You had me running to the xbox pages downloading already lol :p, Sadly there is little we can do about the rest of the scene outside Dcemu:(

But know that what other sites do can't really harm us, It does give the entire scene a bad image.. But there is little we can do about the content other sites carry :( Other then mourn there loss when they get shut down :(

[Voltron]

I wasn't talking about http://xbox-emulation.dcemu.co.uk/ Sorry if
I confused you, I was just talking about the xbox homebrew scene in general how the programs are compiled with the MS XDK. I guess I got a little off topic.

I have an older XBOX just lying around. I was going to sell it since I have a 360. Would it be worth holding on to due to the great homebrew capabilities?

[compoman386]

We don't serve commercial roms and we certainly don't support the idea of downloading and playing, them

Then going back to my original comment, why do dcemu persist in posting screenshots of commercial roms in action whenever a new emu is released?

You surely can't believe that people who come to this site don't download and play commercial roms.

If you don't beleive me, go to the compatiblity thread for pspvba, you will not find anyone posting settings for anything BUT commercial roms.

[shadowprophet]

Then going back to my original comment, why do dcemu persist in posting screenshots of commercial roms in action whenever a new emu is released?


Because firstly. Screenshots of games are not illegal. And secondly. When a new emulator is made. Realize that this emulator is new. There may not be an awful lot if any public domain roms available for this emu as of yet. So mostly these pictures are only to illustrate that the emulator does indeed work. Which is the most important news to get out to the public :p

[nielsss]

Damn, just think about it, look i have downloaded manymovies and psp games using warez and peer to peer but i dont care i'm not buying these expensive games and movies there not worth it and i dont need to go anywhere i can just sit here and think hmm what game should i download...the hombrew will never be able to shut down maybe this site or another but never the whole hombrew scene i mean torrents are still online and peer to peer is still online take it like this how will you get caught??

[Xiaopang]

The thing is this, Emulators are created with the idea that public domain roms can be played in them.


uhm...wrong...just plain wrong...i remember playing snes roms 9 years ago...there is was no homebrew software back then...limited systems like gb, nes, snes etc don't even have a homebrew scene...there are no applications to run on them. these emulators are created to run commercial software. that's the intention on most emulators and the thing most people ask for. another example? chankast does only perform well on commercial games, but doesn't support homebrew software. there are emulators that were created for homebrew software only, but thats a minority...

[compoman386]

Because firstly. Screenshots of games are not illegal. And secondly. When a new emulator is made. Realize that this emulator is new. There may not be an awful lot if any public domain roms available for this emu as of yet. So mostly these pictures are only to illustrate that the emulator does indeed work. Which is the most important news to get out to the public :p


I realise you need to cover your own asses here:) , i am just trying to say that most people who download emulators for their psp, do not do so in order to play PD roms, as I said check the compatibility threads if you doubt this.

[NoQuarter]

Voltron,if you can,softmod that xbox.It's not that hard provided your dashboard and kernal haven't been updated.I have a softmodded xbox and was planning on building a supercomputer cluster out of several of them.That could have alot of usefulness:)I really want to also use it for emulators but as you can see from this thread it somewhat difficult to find legal software for it:(But if you get into the xbox thing pm me sometime.Also after I softmodded mine I put linux on it for free,unlike sony's crap $200 linux kit.Although I can't say much bad about sony's kit I do believe it led to psp homebrew.

[shadowprophet]

uhm...wrong...just plain wrong...i remember playing snes roms 9 years ago...there is was no homebrew software back then...limited systems like gb, nes, snes etc don't even have a homebrew scene...there are no applications to run on them. these emulators are created to run commercial software. that's the intention on most emulators and the thing most people ask for. another example? chankast does only perform well on commercial games, but doesn't support homebrew. there are emulators that were createt for homebrew software only, but thats a minority...


I will say this is clearly as possible and in plane english.. No beating around the bush this time, Im getting sleepy.

We at Dcemu DO NOT support commercial software piracy. We do not condone it. We do not encourage it. We make Homebrew, Games, apps, and emulators, Now picture an emulator like it where a tool. just a common tool you would find in your garage somewhere. Now This tool could be used to do some serious damage if it where used improperly or illegally in a vandalism act. But, Does one blame the tool makers for what (said Vandal) does with that tool? No. one blames the Vandal and his actions that brought about the illegal activity, This is how the law works as well. We at Dcemu Do not support software piracy, period-point blank, there's no clearer way to say it. However we can not and will not and don't really care to try to police what you do own your own time in your own homes, Because its your own business. period. The thing is. One can look for reasons to claim that dcemu does support software piracy, and one will find none. in those rare instances that something has slipped through the cracks it will be taken care of as soon as it is discovered. This rule about warez, no matter how much people wish it where different, WILL NOT CHANGE. The fact is that the warez rule that dcemu enforces, if for the protection of everyone, this entire scene, this network, its simply non negotiable non debatable. non transferable, non refundable, and non exchangeable, It is and will always be the case, Sorry guys, that's really all there is to it.

I don't mean to sound mean, Or anything,
Im just getting really sleepy. And people also need to understand, (ME) im just a guy who really really loves the scene. I would bleed for this scene. It has become on of my most cherished hobbies.:o

If you cut a man he bleeds. But if you cut shadow, he bleeds Dcemu..
I love the scene that much, And I just want to keep it safe. that's all there is to it,
G~night Guys:cool:

[Xiaopang]

I will say this is clearly as possible and in plane english.. No beating around the bush this time, Im getting sleepy.

you can say this as much as you want, but that's not the point here. i quoted you talking about intentions as to why creators code emulators. it's not about justificating them.

[StealthCP]

Stunning article, shadow, you really are a good writer :D

If any of you know I was away on holiday most of July, but enjoyed my hotel's WiFi more than I could imagine on my PSP, from shoutcast radio, to downloading updates to emus from Zx-81 (thanks man :D) and talking on MSN or other IM clients to friends back home.. all while soaking in the sun :D I was even able to do so on South beach, so grab your kit and get packing!

Though once I came back I not only returned to Dcemu (site was to powerful for Links2 - stupid "out of memory" messages.. :P) but I also crawled the web, and boy I saw what had happened to PSP homebrew since I was away. Man I've been fully awake now ever since, and shadow's article here just served as a substitute to this morning's coffee.

[Voltron]

Voltron,if you can,softmod that xbox.It's not that hard provided your dashboard and kernal haven't been updated.

How would I know if dashboard/kernel have been updated? I used to play Halo 2 religously which occasionally said it needed to update. I always thought it was updating XBOX Live.

The XBOX has not been played since maybe September/October 2005. Perhaps I could still softmod?

It seems that XBOX has a very mature homebrew scene. I just never paid attention to it being preoccupied with the PSP.

Any links, google search terms, or advice for an XBOX homebrew n00b would be most appreciated.

[mr_nick666]

Its been a while since we've had a good 'Shadow Rant' :o You are wise and sage my friend ;) The homebrew scene wont ever be killed though it will just go underground if it came to it... The loss would be sites like these :( Im a daily visitor to DCEMU and I like it here... I like the people, the articles and the mormon homebrew way of life here :D Lets just keep it clean :p

[SSaxdude]

Another "piracy is bad" article. Sony wants to stop ALL hacking/homebrew no matter if it condones piracy or not. An example is how they blocked the GTA eLoader on 2.7 before there was ever a downgrader.

I love this site because of the environment, but I'm tired of people telling me what's right from wrong.

[Topknot]

While I agree with many points within your article, I find it fairly trite. Especially this:

"realize that things like iso loaders that load commercial software do a lot more then encourage one to download illegal warez (stolen commercial property) They damage our scene buy putting us in the hot seat. all that needs to be done to shut any site down is some mistake to be caught under that micro scope and a cease and desist order from some corporation and poof, the scene is no more.."

It cannot be hard for an educated person to see that if ISO loaders promote people to download sony ISO's then by that rational emulators promote people to go download commercial roms. I dont doubt that over 90% of the people here (and thats being generous) have no idea on how to legally back up a snes cartridge, I am fairly certain everyone here downloads MAME roms because lets face it, if your using MAME where are you legally getting your rom backups from. Open BOR promotes people to go download paks with artwork and characters from commercial games illegally, not to mention the countless amounts of homebrew using commercial artwork within it.

What would happen if Nintendo begin issuing cease and desist orders on sites serving out emulators once they get the virtual console thing going on the Wii? Will all of a sudden emu's be the "evil" side of the scene? I should be able to play EVERY newest game available for the PSP without losing functionality. Devhook, is a damn godsend for homebrew users end of story. Otherwise 1.5ers would be sitting playing illegal SNES games or Genesis games, or GBA games, etc, etc, etc.

Its funny that because Nintendo/Sega etc havnt shown any concern over emulators on the PSP, things like DGEN and Snes tyl are considered acceptable while devhook is not despite the fact that devhook allows you to play your LEGAL umd's and DGEN DOES NOT ADD A CARTRIDGE SLOT TO THE PSP. Dont talk about illegally backed up UMD's for use with devhook, or even using LEGAL, proper UMD disks with devhook... talk all you want about illegally backed up game cartridges for use on an emulator.

Snes emulator emulating a SNES so you can play illegally ripped/downloaded cartridge roms, devhook emulating PSP firmware so you can legally use your store bought UMD disk or illegally ripped/downloaded copy of a game. This site, and MANY others needs to stop kidding itself on this subject, you hide behind no piracy in regards to sony matters because they activly issues cease and desists over it but you act like pirating SNES/GENESIS games is morally better? And why? Well it seems like its because Sony are the only peolpe throwing legal threats about.

I wonder if Nintendo made a press release tomorrow stating they actually dont like SNES emu's or people downloading the games they plan on distributing via the Wii's virtual console, would we see an article on emulators part in the "dark side" of our scene?

This article and any claims of anti piracy is a joke and hippocritical in the eyes of anyone with an IQ over 100 and yet I just know that a) some mod or site admin is going to give some reason why emulators dont actually encourage people to load google up and type in "SNES roms" and yet devhook activly encourages people to go on a torrent site and type in "PSP games".. and b) a slew of ignorant asskissers will get offensive in there posts about this.

If you ask me, articles like this and hippocritical actions by sites are the "evil side" of homebrew...

[fistikuffs]

Regarding devs ripping sprites music etc from commercial games for homebrew.....
Personally i never play these type of mods. There is so much talent in this scene that i don't think is being used appropriatley with these mods. But i have an idea. Is it possible to start up some type of 'creative commons' type pool of material for game devs. What i mean by this is have somewhere where poeple can sumbit there own sprites, artwork, music and even stories. Devs can then go to this pool and pick stuff they would like to use.

Just think about it...all original content waiting to inspire the devs instead of looking at old games actually creating entirely original content in a truly utopian collabaritive style. Eventually this would develop into teams of people regularly collaborating
on homebrew developing their skills to a much higher level and benifiting absolutely everyone with higher quality, original homebrew. What do you think?

ps. i hope i'm not too far off topic:D

[notaforumtroll]

fistikuffs : what you speak of towards the end of your post already exists, they are called game dev studios where people actually get paid money for their hard work (which i exploit and undermind with the useage of my totally awesome ISO collection )instead of flamed and praised on internet forums.


" Software piracy, Warez, ISO'S, "
The only reason lots of us are on the internet. Also the only reason lots of us are into the psp unit. If psp didnt offer iso loaders and such an awesome warez scene, it would be another garbage sony console with over priced games and junk homebrew, who gives a shit about remote controls and nintendo emus, i'll bet any money that 90% of people if they were given the choice between running strictly emu's and home brew titles, or ISO related goodies, would side with ISOS.

.ISO WNED.

As for legality of it all who gives a shit? dont shamelessly promote your work on a website and make yourself available to the world via a www. address, Booster is genius, except for the fact he put himself out there, had devhook been released through the grapevine (irc/torrents/ftp/rapid shares) sony would of had to shut down and pursue each outlet, and wouldnt of been able to get ahold of booster or the source of devhook.

"SO I'VE DECIDED TO TAKE MY WORK BACK UNDERGROUND, TO KEEP IT FROM FALLING INTO THE WRONG HANDS...."

too ****ing late for that bro

[fistikuffs]

"fistikuffs : what you speak of towards the end of your post already exists, they are called game dev studios where people actually get paid money for their hard work (which i exploit and undermind with the useage of my totally awesome ISO collection )instead of flamed and praised on internet forums."

But what i'm talking about is a non commercial version of this giving people who don't do that work professionally the oppurtunity to work on homebrew games and deveolpe their skills. Didn't i just say that?

[1003G1]

You like saying "Make No Mistake" haha.
Pretty pointless article really. Nothing is gonna happen to the homebrew scene. It's not illegal so Sony or anyone else can't do anything aboot it. They can make threats all they want but all they will be doing is providing us with something to laugh at.
I wish everyone would stop being so dramatic aboot the homebrew scene. Just keep everything leagal and we'll be fine.

[Pico]

You have to understand, this particular copyright issue was just recently brought to light,
You also have to take into account, that none of us staff are certified legal technicians. we do our best, and even still some things will slip through the cracks. We simply don't have the time, to disassemble and examine every piece of homebrew that comes our way, But I assure you.
When something illegal is discovered it is put into evaluation, until it is either cleared or removed.
You have to also consider that you are getting your legal issues crossed here most if the issues you are talking about fall into the fan ware category, (fan recreations of art sprites that someone created there selves)- it is not illegal to use those. provided the user had permission form there creator. while its true. that certain art and music have slipped by us, that where commercial property, since then a strict new policy has taken effect. while we fell it unnecessary to evaluate every piece of homebrew we have, when we do discover something illegal that has slipped through the cracks it will generally disappear rather quickly.

Web Site http://www.factor5.com
Address 101 Lucas Valley Rd., Suite 300 San Rafael, CA 94903 USA
Phone 415-492-5900
Email [email protected]

Here a link to a mobile phone version by THQ
http://uk.gamespot.com/mobile/action/turrican/index.html
Type a games name in gooogle and you'll find all the information you'll ever need.


"You have to understand, this particular copyright issue was just recently brought to light". So there is a copyright issue, I just wanted to make the point that if you enquire with the company your quite likely to find out where you stand (capcom are the best example, look at any hl2 mod site).

"You have to also consider that you are getting your legal issues crossed here most if the issues you are talking about fall into the fan ware category". No your skirting the issue you cant assume its ok just because its "fan ware" this is where the problems start and why homebrew is frowned upon. People who make things useing other peoples Interlectual property shoud be respectful, responsible for there actions and find out whatever they need to know, but the big problem is that no sites (dev,news sites) have even looked into the matter and set up simple guidelines on such things either. How things are now homebrew will stay where it is if sites that report and distribute it act as if there not responsible for any of the content either, ethics and leading by example just dont seem to exist (unless its bitching about how the dreaded "WAREZ IS KILLING HOMEBREW"). One day it'll sort itself out, but right now there no clear pioneers in whats needed, maby due to petty fights between certain sites.

This threads still got steam (i think) :)

[Xiaopang]

You like saying "Make No Mistake" haha.
Pretty pointless article really. Nothing is gonna happen to the homebrew scene. It's not illegal so Sony or anyone else can't do anything aboot it. They can make threats all they want but all they will be doing is providing us with something to laugh at.
I wish everyone would stop being so dramatic aboot the homebrew scene. Just keep everything leagal and we'll be fine.

absolutely right. they have better stuff to do than that

[DPyro]

Its funny that because Nintendo/Sega etc havnt shown any concern over emulators on the PSP, things like DGEN and Snes tyl are considered acceptable while devhook is not despite the fact that devhook allows you to play your LEGAL umd's and DGEN DOES NOT ADD A CARTRIDGE SLOT TO THE PSP. Dont talk about illegally backed up UMD's for use with devhook, or even using LEGAL, proper UMD disks with devhook... talk all you want about illegally backed up game cartridges for use on an emulator.

Snes emulator emulating a SNES so you can play illegally ripped/downloaded cartridge roms, devhook emulating PSP firmware so you can legally use your store bought UMD disk or illegally ripped/downloaded copy of a game.
Thats exactly my view right there. Certainly its much easier for us to BACKUP our LEGAL UMDs than it is to backup our SNES/GBA/N64/Whatever. Therefor I don't think we should be saying the full version of Devhook is illegal (and therefor this site should host the full version of Devhook).

The views expressed in this post are of the posters, and does not represent the views of DCEmu

[Accordion]

of course that starts the debate over the morality of supporting new live consoles, and being able o take advantage over past consoles, which do not create new income for the producer...
except for nintendo of course, who rely on its back catlog for most of its sales...

[doverkiller]

nothing will stop software privacy, until money-hungry firms want to ripoff us with crap..

I repeat NOTHING!!!
not even our pure soul, not even laws and stuff..

Anyone would love to buy genuine software, if they could afford it, AND (mostly) if the sotfware could hit THE QUALITY..

I've bought every single software what I've downloaded, used and realised it's damn great!!
I've bought every movies on DVD, what I saw in cinema or divx, and was amazing..

I've tested ISO games on my PSP, and many were crap..
I was wondering what if I've bought this game on UMD..
I would tear it into pieces.. :mad:

There are not even demos of PSP games (except the few)
We can see only video trailers, with minimal actual gameplay..

So don't ask me to buy UMDs blind for 1/4 price of a PSP..

well, this about the "dark side" of homebrew..
Please give this to the record..


Steve

[Xiaopang]

don't you mean the dark side of commercial psp games?

[hempy]

i agree with what u are saying...Too bad the article seems to have been writen by a below-average high school student. Learn how to write.

[shadowprophet]

i agree with what u are saying...Too bad the article seems to have been writen by a below-average high school student. Learn how to write.

Hmm.. For someone that seems to know about writing, You would think you wouldn't forget a rule as simple as to start a sentence out with a capital, especially when that letter is I... Go figure..

[Milleniumas]

WTF, i won't buy any f*cking psp game couse it costs half price of psp (yea that's true in our country). F*ck any game original that is legal and it's fun to play in our country costs like 1/5 of all the average payout. Just f*ck up sony and all the companies, but this is just insane!. Piracy here I come ! (in our country average payout is 1000 and the game costs 189.99, psp you can buy from other country just for ~500, in shops our it's 999).

[Xiaopang]

lol how ridiculous can you get...who cares for capital writing...it's a forum for god sakes and not a newspaper...btw, he is right. the article wouldn't qualify for a magazine...

[Panini]

While I agree with many points within your article, I find it fairly trite. Especially this:

"realize that things like iso loaders that load commercial software do a lot more then encourage one to download illegal warez (stolen commercial property) They damage our scene buy putting us in the hot seat. all that needs to be done to shut any site down is some mistake to be caught under that micro scope and a cease and desist order from some corporation and poof, the scene is no more.."

It cannot be hard for an educated person to see that if ISO loaders promote people to download sony ISO's then by that rational emulators promote people to go download commercial roms. I dont doubt that over 90% of the people here (and thats being generous) have no idea on how to legally back up a snes cartridge, I am fairly certain everyone here downloads MAME roms because lets face it, if your using MAME where are you legally getting your rom backups from. Open BOR promotes people to go download paks with artwork and characters from commercial games illegally, not to mention the countless amounts of homebrew using commercial artwork within it.

What would happen if Nintendo begin issuing cease and desist orders on sites serving out emulators once they get the virtual console thing going on the Wii? Will all of a sudden emu's be the "evil" side of the scene? I should be able to play EVERY newest game available for the PSP without losing functionality. Devhook, is a damn godsend for homebrew users end of story. Otherwise 1.5ers would be sitting playing illegal SNES games or Genesis games, or GBA games, etc, etc, etc.

Its funny that because Nintendo/Sega etc havnt shown any concern over emulators on the PSP, things like DGEN and Snes tyl are considered acceptable while devhook is not despite the fact that devhook allows you to play your LEGAL umd's and DGEN DOES NOT ADD A CARTRIDGE SLOT TO THE PSP. Dont talk about illegally backed up UMD's for use with devhook, or even using LEGAL, proper UMD disks with devhook... talk all you want about illegally backed up game cartridges for use on an emulator.

Snes emulator emulating a SNES so you can play illegally ripped/downloaded cartridge roms, devhook emulating PSP firmware so you can legally use your store bought UMD disk or illegally ripped/downloaded copy of a game. This site, and MANY others needs to stop kidding itself on this subject, you hide behind no piracy in regards to sony matters because they activly issues cease and desists over it but you act like pirating SNES/GENESIS games is morally better? And why? Well it seems like its because Sony are the only peolpe throwing legal threats about.

I wonder if Nintendo made a press release tomorrow stating they actually dont like SNES emu's or people downloading the games they plan on distributing via the Wii's virtual console, would we see an article on emulators part in the "dark side" of our scene?

This article and any claims of anti piracy is a joke and hippocritical in the eyes of anyone with an IQ over 100 and yet I just know that a) some mod or site admin is going to give some reason why emulators dont actually encourage people to load google up and type in "SNES roms" and yet devhook activly encourages people to go on a torrent site and type in "PSP games".. and b) a slew of ignorant asskissers will get offensive in there posts about this.

If you ask me, articles like this and hippocritical actions by sites are the "evil side" of homebrew...


This guy makes alot of sense! :D

[Voltron]

You see how much attention and how many replies this sort of thread gets. Alls these types of threads do is create controversy (which may be the intention) and cause a divide in the PSP homebrew scene. Lets get over the "ISO Loading means your a pirate" nonsense.

UMD Emulation & other console Emulation go hand in hand. ISO's & PSP homebrew are now pretty much synonymous. Its all the same to Sony and they are against it ALL.

I sense this site in relation to the PSP is really feeling the pressure as most users find many administrative views hypocritical. Some people are more outspoken about it than others.

Lets all acknowledge that UMD emulation is not going anywhere and lets get over it and move on. The most damaging thing to PSP homebrew is this type of infighting and bickering.

[shadowprophet]

Personally. I don't see why (some) people have to resort to insults and trolling.
Is it because they cant find reasonable material to debate with. honestly, to me. People who have to resort to flaming/ trolling, rather then intelligible debate, seem to be the people in need of some education to me.

[Xiaopang]

i think Shadowprophet said that just because hempy told him to "learn how to write," and then he makes a grammatical error

yeah, but since he started his other sentences with capital letters, his so called mistake was nothing more than a typo...pretty lame to rant on that

[DPyro]

If anyone else continues to go off-topic they will be issued a warning.

[Baboon]

This thread isn’t really going anywhere ...everyone’s just getting a bit tetchy.

Where has all the love gone people? lol

[Voltron]

This guy makes alot of sense! :D
Yes, his post really spelled it out quite nicely. A lot of people don't speak their mind on this forum in fear of being flamed by the "I hate ISO crowd".

We are not all pirates and criminals. If you don't want to use ISO's don't use them. But stop pretending that UMD Emulation is not a big part of PSP homebrew.

Sure we must all respect the views and opinions of the DCEMU admins but we should also be able to speak our mind.

[ritz]

This was a very well written article. And true in most respects. However, speaking for myself, I have discovered games from older consoles that I never knew were out there. So while my downloading of these games may have been illegal at first, It really has pushed sales for these older games. Is that wrong?

[compoman386]

.......It cannot be hard for an educated person to see that if ISO loaders promote people to download sony ISO's then by that rational emulators promote people to go download commercial roms. I dont doubt that over 90% of the people here (and thats being generous) have no idea on how to legally back up a snes cartridge, I am fairly certain everyone here downloads MAME roms because lets face it, if your using MAME where are you legally getting your rom backups from........


This is exactly the point I was trying to make towards the start of this thread, shadowprophet didn't seem too convinced though.

I am not saying it is right or wrong to use commercial roms, individuals can make that choice for themselves.

[compoman386]

Somehow I always knew it would end this way..

**** it im done....

Then why start such a contoversial topic in the first place.

Im sorry that not everyon agrees with you, but I thought that was what this forum was for, open debate of ideas etc

Hope you decide not to quit for real.

[DPyro]

I guess the b@stards won :(

[dejkirkby]

Don't quit Shadow
For every clown who dogs you for having a conscience and wanting to keep the scene as legal as possibe, there are 10 of us who appreciate what you and all the other devs are done.
Don't
Fire
Shadowprophet!

[vettacossx]

wow! ok after reading this WHOLE 88 post thread OMG ive decided im just going to stop modding all together this makes me very nervous and from a modders point of veiw:

i only bothered to spend 4 hours a day modding for months on end for one SOUL PURPOSE .....no not to PISS OFF THE BIG GUYS... but to do as I HAD PROMISED to offer replay value to gr8 HOMEBREW games...however the LINE we are refering to IS FAR FROM THIN as a matter of fact its danm near...INVISABLE! and that is the reason i think i 2 will go the way of my BROTHER and FRIEND pspdemon....because the facts seem to be that its not just FANBREW theres no such thing???? i mean if its not popular....then hell thats ok to have out....SMW??? all our mario games sonic games.....these are icons we have grown to love and cherish...but i for one will not jepordise my fav site on the net;) if its become this BIG OF A DEAL it has felt like a DRAMA FESWT and danm soap opera the last month OMG im going to just join a team for GFX and make original badass NEW ICONS FOR YOU ALL TO BECOME ATACHED TO !!!

im sorry if anyones REQUEST MODS didnt get done IF YOU MAIL ME ILL SEE WHAT I CAN DO but JMV nolonger can see making games by request because what you want is apparently ILLEGAL?! i dont know to be honest the line is just as invisable to me as it seems it is to everyone so i guess the only way to resolve this is the go ALL ORIGINAL as boring as that can be.....and as irritated as i am that I AM GOING TO HAVE TO SAY NO to my FANs,FRIENS,AND DC-HOMIEZ AND IF YOU ASK ....I HAVE NEVER EVER SAID NO BEFOTRE TO ANY REQUEST FOR A MOD HERE AT DCEMU NOT EVEN ONE.....
WHAT A SAD SAD SAD TIME>>>>>>>
the downgrader......emulating 2.7.....that shit was just the CALM BEFORE THE STORM

SORRY FOR EVERYTHING
vettacossx..:(

[NoQuarter]

Woah! This thread got crazy while I was gone.

[doverkiller]

I wonder how we will play 1CD(800MB) PS1 games on the PSP.. :D
But most of all, how will we get them via Wifi.. lol :D

If I were Sony UMD burner and UMD-RW were on the market already..
that would triple the sellings for sure! :)
( well not of UMD games and movies :)

[NoQuarter]

Disc based media is just to easy for people to pirate I think sony is going to try and move away from it somehow,I dunno how but somehow.Not to mention optical drives don't last very long.

[vettacossx]

ROMS ARE ILLEGAL 2 BILL CLINTONS INTERNET PRIVACY ACT IS FAKE!!

FYI

vetta is doing some research....and it seems to be legal is much easier SAID>>>>>than DONE :( READ ON MY FRIENDS DONT BE FOOLED!

http://www.lpconline.com/internet_privacy_act.html

theres seems to be alot more to know than ANY ONE PERSON COULD POSSIBLY remember but its NEED TO KNOW INFO AT THAT LINK FOR YOUR OWN LEGAL PROTECTION CHECK THAT OUT! ;)

[lucidtraveller]

wow, alot to read.....
i am bigtime into emulation, i used to collect the classics but spent my time organising a housefull of cartridges and systems, then sold it all and now have it all in my pocket which i like, i actually do play the classic stuff too, i have not messed with iso's yet but if i didn't have a memorystick full of old games i most likely would but from what i have seen i doubt i would be captivated by any of the real psp games.
i actually do download the "legal" roms too and sometimes am pleasantly suprised too :)

all i know is that this is the only site that has a good atmosphere about it, i have been coming to this network since the dreamcast days (no longer have one though due to ******* burglars :P ) and it seems like all other sites touching on homebrew are just a bunch of foul mouthed kids wanting to pirate stuff who have no clue about the joy of homebrew and emulators......

just wanted to speak, not sure if i said anything but this is by far the best site for homebrew even if it is monitored......any other site i wouldn't have been able to even type this because the response would just be some ass talking outta his ass ;)

[shadowprophet]

Shadow is human. Sometimes his human side shows too clearly.

I think thats why I normaly get along with everyone in the forums. (normaly) I never lose touch with my roots and where I came from, Before I was moded.
I was a member in these forums just like you guys.
And in those days it was common for me to debate and rant. and even argue my points. When I became a mod, My hobby became more difficult. as I had to obay the proper standing on how a mod should represent himself while learning the in's and outs of the job. But ultimately nothing that has ever happend to me or will happen, will ever take away who I am, Im a proud member of dcemu. Mod or member. it doesnt matter to me. I am who I am.
And I love this scene. And as far as quiting goes, that will never happen. People say things when there up for over 34 hours and talking out of there head, And a few nay sayers kicking and screaming because they cant have illegal software piracy doesnt help..
And yeah, even us mods get offended and have a bad day at times. remember We have a certain image to uphold, But that doesn mean where not human..

[pepegomez]

well... its that pathetic iso discussion again...
if sony cant stop warez, its their problem not mine...

[Mystic8277]

Voltron: PM me. It won't let me PM you for some reason.

[vettacossx]

Shadow is human. Sometimes his human side shows too clearly.

I think thats why I normaly get along with everyone in the forums. (normaly) I never lose touch with my roots and where I came from, Before I was moded.
I was a member in these forums just like you guys.
And in those days it was common for me to debate and rant. and even argue my points. When I became a mod, My hobby became more difficult. as I had to obay the proper standing on how a mod should represent himself while learning the in's and outs of the job. But ultimately nothing that has ever happend to me or will happen, will ever take away who I am, Im a proud member of dcemu. Mod or member. it doesnt matter to me. I am who I am.
And I love this scene. And as far as quiting goes, that will never happen. People say things when there up for over 34 hours and talking out of there head, And a few nay sayers kicking and screaming because they cant have illegal software piracy doesnt help..
And yeah, even us mods get offended and have a bad day at times. remember We have a certain image to uphold, But that doesn mean where not human..
__________________



i miss SP :( wheres the spunk buddy! omg theres so much drama and so lil communication! what is going on cant we mail each other anymore.....be friends ive been trying to find out what the hell was going on here at dcemu for days and your like my best friend and a brother.....i couldnt even get a hold of you!!! so i stoped modding because as you know i only sent my mods to you! and if i did get you in touble by making super mario war skins 3 or turrican or smm mods i am truley sorry....but out of everyone here...the last person i thought would ever LACK communication.....alasss has not promtley answer my mails as he always has in the past........so i declare .....SHANNANIGINS in the spirit of the once happy......funny......spitefull guy i know as shadow prophet! ;) chin up buddy.....im doing all original mods even though ...

ALL MODS THAT JMV DID....WERE BY DCEMU MEMBER REQUEST!!!......what we want.......and what we can have are 2 different things.....so im sorry to all who made request i didnt get to! like macross;) the JMV comedy series and the DBZ turrican mods...:( JMV is no more i will now move on to original mods and work with people needing gfx assistance....

[Sauron96]

Most people just use "homebrew" as their cute little code word for piracy...

"I'll never give up my 1.5 psp because of homebrew"

Yeah, sure.

Anyway, just deal with it...talking about it here EVERY DAY will not make people change their minds.

[Mystic8277]

Most people just use "homebrew" as their cute little code word for piracy...

"I'll never give up my 1.5 psp because of homebrew"

Yeah, sure.

Anyway, just deal with it...talking about it here EVERY DAY will not make people change their minds.
http://img365.imageshack.us/img365/5812/orlyxn8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
No, people use the word "homebrew" for homebrew.

[Apoklepz]

Very nice article Shadowprophet. I would say more, but I'm way too busy today...You know, because of this utopian society we all live in. meh.

[Gizmo356]

jmv no more whats next :(

[shadowprophet]

i miss SP :( wheres the spunk buddy! omg theres so much drama and so lil communication! what is going on cant we mail each other anymore.....be friends ive been trying to find out what the hell was going on here at dcemu for days and your like my best friend and a brother.....i couldnt even get a hold of you!!! so i stoped modding because as you know i only sent my mods to you! and if i did get you in touble by making super mario war skins 3 or turrican or smm mods i am truley sorry....but out of everyone here...the last person i thought would ever LACK communication.....alasss has not promtley answer my mails as he always has in the past........so i declare .....SHANNANIGINS in the spirit of the once happy......funny......spitefull guy i know as shadow prophet! ;) chin up buddy.....im doing all original mods even though ...

ALL MODS THAT JMV DID....WERE BY DCEMU MEMBER REQUEST!!!......what we want.......and what we can have are 2 different things.....so im sorry to all who made request i didnt get to! like macross;) the JMV comedy series and the DBZ turrican mods...:( JMV is no more i will now move on to original mods and work with people needing gfx assistance....
Its not at all like that, Ive been gone for a while because my brother has moved in. I havnt had a lot of time to do my normal job. I'll pop in sometimes late at night and write an atricle, something anything to contribute ;)
But I havnt had much time on my hands at all lately :cool: Things will slowly get back to normal here, But its a very long unexplainible situation, as to why my brother moveing in cuts into my forum time, But believe me bro, everything is fine with your mods, Keep modding and ill keep posting them em bro , just like always ;)

[ptr.exe]

I think there's something wrong in what you say, and it is that homebrew/open source can't be stopped. that's it, exactly how it sounds.

it doesn't matter if it is legal or not. it's just too big for anyone to stop it.

of course, they can make it difficult. let's say...don't let homebrew run on their hardware. oh! they've already done it! and they failed... :)
Completely agree. I think you're blowing this way out of proportion.

I don't believe that illegal code in one app will damage the entire scene. What effect would it have on other legitimate code? None. If other legit homebrew came under scrutiny from companies they would have nothing to worry about.

They can't stop open source coding.

[vettacossx]

i cant....heres why....some sprites ive used were not original sprites and APPARENTLY no one can explain to me the " fine line" that sepperates fanbrew wich i thought i was doing untill today when pspdemon decided to do all original....it made me think....AM I DOING SOMTHING WRONG even though i hand made the sprites for my SMM and SMW mods.....i used MODIFIED RIPPED DBZ sprites for my turrican....AM I LEGAL....HOW DO I KNOW??

[Xiaopang]

AM I LEGAL....HOW DO I KNOW??

by getting a lawyer...seriously...technically you are using copyrighted material. still, depending on your country you might be allowed to use original work to parody it without having to pay licence fees. thats why any so called legal-illegal discussion is so obsolete. only a lawyer knows for sure and even then i wouldn't bet on a definite answer, because as far as i know, there was never a trial regarding this, just to assure your legal status.

BUT the more important question you should ask is: do companies care? everyone who ever meddled with the anti-piracy taskforces of those corporations will tell you: no they don't. why? because you don't sell it and the number of users are far too low to affect anything. besides, if they did, they could also take legal actions against fanart as that is a ripoff of original artwork, too. in fact they have bigger cases to rest, such as corporate piracy.

so there's no reason to panic

[SteveV2]

You can look at it both ways, people should not use copied games on thier psps.

But should psp game really be up for £35? I mean £35, how many GTAs were sold last year? Thousands, you do the maths.

How much does it cost to make a UMD disc? Not alot, I bought GTA from play.com and in the jiffy bag was a demo of loco roco for free!

If Sony dropped the prices a bit then i'm sure more games would be bought.

It's all about the money, if the prices were dropped a bit then I certain they would have more!

But PSP ISO talk here should be banned, it's a current product unlike the likes of PSX nad neogeocd.

My psp is used mainly for games gone by and the UMDs I play, I bought, 4 of 'em :)

[vettacossx]

by getting a lawyer...seriously...technically you are using copyrighted material. still, depending on your country you might be allowed to use original work to parody it without having to pay licence fees. thats why any so called legal-illegal discussion is so obsolete. only a lawyer knows for sure and even then i wouldn't bet on a definite answer, because as far as i know, there was never a trial regarding this, just to assure your legal status.

BUT the more important question you should ask is: do companies care? everyone who ever meddled with the anti-piracy taskforces of those corporations will tell you: no they don't. why? because you don't sell it and the number of users are far too low to affect anything. besides, if they did, they could also take legal actions against fanart as that is a ripoff of original artwork, too. in fact they have bigger cases to rest, such as corporate piracy.

so there's no reason to panicim not really paniced so much as confued??
so its illegal.....but i shouldnt be concerned? im agains UMD piracy all the way2.....and i 2 beleave that IF ITS STILL BEING SOLD then support it otherwise there wouldnt be sequals ;) but i didnt think that make a lil mod " themed " of a cartoon or videogame charicter was ILLEGAL for cryin out loud!;)

[Xiaopang]

well, it could be illegal, could be legal (think of the parody-example i mentioned). no one will sue you because you did that. there are tons of mods out there for years now and guess how many guys had to stand trial for doing this: 0

not even the maker of the hot coffee mod for gta which got rockstar into trouble and some very bad press had anythig to fear. so don't worry, everythings cool.

[Basil Zero]

I'm really not worried about whether the homebrew scene would die or not, because even though one site may be forced to be down, there's always gonna be another one up anyways.

[NeoXCS]

DCEMU is the most dedicated scene to homebrew. I love to see a site that actually watches and cares about the scene it contains, making sure no illegal or controversal type software gets onto it. SP I've been watching you rant since way back around when PSP homebrew started and you still rant with the best of them! :p Let's just keep the scene as legit as possible so we may see inovations for a long time to come. :)

[pepegomez]

are there countrys wehre piracy is legal? i doubt so

[Kramer]

yeah im sure 3rd world countries arent too strict about piracy.
asian countries have piracy going on everywhere even though its illegal the police dont really care they have shops full off pirated dvds ps2 games everything.

[ferret45]

How do you think nintendo feel about people creating homebrew with mario and zelda featuring in them? that must be copyright infringement?
mabye dcemu should stop hosting them if they truly whant to keep legit

[shadow77]

The proof is out there, Sony discovered commercial software imbedded in a certain firmware emulation application and issued a cease and desist order to its respective developer.

BOOSTER was NOT given a cease and desist order.

The modules that are created when you run the firmware installer are extracted from the EBOOT.PBP, it is illegal to share these files. Some no-name person uploaded a copy of devhook to the site with those files included, thus - the site admin was given a cease and desist order.

but it was NOT because of devhook, and BOOSTER was not harmed. Devhook contains no illegal code.

[NoQuarter]

This is true

[Pico]

.

so there's no reason to panicim not really paniced so much as confued??
so its illegal.....but i shouldnt be concerned? im agains UMD piracy all the way2.....and i 2 beleave that IF ITS STILL BEING SOLD then support it otherwise there wouldnt be sequals ;) but i didnt think that make a lil mod " themed " of a cartoon or videogame charicter was ILLEGAL for cryin out loud!;) Well you made a simpsons turrican mod thats why i used turrican as an example before, last year (or the one before) matt groening's legal people where threatening simsons fan site's with legal action because of the content (these case's was concerning sound files no bigger than 350k and sprite rips/animated screen caps).

[grin.ch]

The proof is out there, Sony discovered commercial software imbedded in a certain firmware emulation application and issued a cease and desist order to its respective developer.

BOOSTER was NOT given a cease and desist order.

The modules that are created when you run the firmware installer are extracted from the EBOOT.PBP, it is illegal to share these files. Some no-name person uploaded a copy of devhook to the site with those files included, thus - the site admin was given a cease and desist order.

but it was NOT because of devhook, and BOOSTER was not harmed. Devhook contains no illegal code.

AND


This is true

+1

This IS True. Booster has been very smart about his releases.

[fire master]

I think that the homebrew scene is the best and will stay that way,but if Sony,Nintendo and Microsoft keep on trying to block homebrew and destroy it many people would be devistated. I could also say that the three major companys who block homebrew actually play it. Also I dont like people who steal ISO's because it is against the law and I don't go against the law. I think this was a goood read and will affect many people.

[vettacossx]

The proof is out there, Sony discovered commercial software imbedded in a certain firmware emulation application and issued a cease and desist order to its respective developer.

BOOSTER was NOT given a cease and desist order.

The modules that are created when you run the firmware installer are extracted from the EBOOT.PBP, it is illegal to share these files. Some no-name person uploaded a copy of devhook to the site with those files included, thus - the site admin was given a cease and desist order.

but it was NOT because of devhook, and BOOSTER was not harmed. Devhook contains no illegal code.


SO PDSP HACKS GOT A CEASE AND DESIST NOT BOOSTER??? HMMMMM GETTING HARD TO SEPPERATE FACT FROM FICTION!!!!! A THIN LINE INDEED!!!


Well you made a simpsons turrican mod thats why i used turrican as an example before, last year (or the one before) matt groening's legal people where threatening simsons fan site's with legal action because of the content (these case's was concerning sound files no bigger than 350k and sprite rips/animated screen caps).

ok first THAT WAS NOT A DIRECT SPRITE RIP....MORE THAN THAT IT WASNT RIPPED FROM ANYTHING!!! ....LMAO>...you see vetta has been doing some research.....i even considered STOPPING my mods if it turned out it could efect my fav. psp site....so i wrote to a few moderators seeking some sort of CLEARER explination......after a day on google what ive found is this ......THE FACT IS ALL BUT MY DBZ MODS were ALL MADE BY HAND IN MSPAINT AND OTHER VARIOUS APPS microsoft photo edditor....ect...AND WERE NOT RIPS OF ANYONES SPRITES BUT ORRIGINALS .....FURTHER MORE.... the DBZ sprites that i used were not FROM A GAME but i did however use a PICTURE from the oficial DBZ SITE to make the UPPER HALF of goku ss4 as it seemed nearly impossible to desighn him in time for release.....but you can bet .....now that i FULLY understand my rights ...AND SHADOW PROPHET has told me that my mods are PERFECTLY LEGAL FANBREW GENRE MODS .......you can bet im gonna jump back into my fav hobby modding our fav homebrew....and doing what JMV does.....and promise ayou all in the begining....TO OFFER REPLAY VALUE BY REQUEST to the BEST of THE BEST homebrew!
sorry for the panic guiys....JMV just wants to stay legit ;) and would not ever take the chance of HURTING DCemu psp-news in ANYWAY...

[Xiaopang]

are there countrys wehre piracy is legal? i doubt so

yeah, china has no copyright laws

[aleborri]

First I haven't read all the pages on this thread so excuse me if what I may say is already mentioned somewhere.

First, interesting, well written article, Shadowprophet, anything that's food for thought and exposed this clearly is always a nice read.

But I can't agree with you on several aspects. First, I understand a utopian society as a society that exists in perfect balance, and obviously a homebrew society as you describe is imperfect because income is not based in homebrew productivity. A perfect homebrew society would have to be able to generate income through homebrew itself.

Also, in terms of ISOs, warez and copyright material, you're being too candid at best, or hypocritical at worst. You're obviously against ISO loaders, but I have a legal copy of all of the ISOs I load, however I have 1) At least in my country, the right to have a backup of any software I purchase 2) The convenience of being able to carry many games in my MS without the annoyance of carrying all the UMDs, or they getting damaged on the way, plus better performance on reading speed and the ability to overclock the machine itself.

On the other hand, 95% of PSP homebrew are emulators, which emulate systems that many don't own (CPS2 board anyone) and of course games that you don't own either, thus morally I feel less legitimate to play emulators than ISOs.

Basically, it seems that the morality under your words is that it's bad to use warez applications as far as they can damage the scene as a whole, the emulation sites and the developers and users themselves, but much of the perfection under the homebrew scene you care for and talk about does attack private property, however the difference is that the owners of that property won't give "cease and desist" orders, thus I see it, as mentioned, overall as either candid or hypocritical position.