Next Sonic game for PSP

[Eviltaco64]

Hello, Eviltaco64 here.

As a Sonic fan from the beginning, I want to play the best Sonics there are.

Sonic Rivals is a fun game, dont get me wrong, but I honestly dont think it lives up to Sonic standards.

What do you think would be the best idea for a PSP Sonic game?

-Cheers,
Eviltaco64

[Eviltaco64]

In my opinion, a Sonic Adventure 1 port would probably one of the best things to grace the PSP.

With the extra 111 MHz of power, I'm sure it can be done.

[Medion]

In my opinion, a Sonic Adventure 1 port would probably one of the best things to grace the PSP.

With the extra 111 MHz of power, I'm sure it can be done.

Never look at the clock speed of a CPU and assume that's the deciding factor. There's more than just megahertz.

The Dreamcast featured 8MB of video memory, as well as up to 6x or 10x texture compression (depending on your source). The PSP features 2MB edram for video. That's a huge bottleneck right there.

Yea, the game could be ported, especially being a first gen DC game. There could be some improvements, and there likely would be some minor drawbacks. My point is, don't assume that the clock speed is the only important factor.

As for me, I'd like to see an update to Sonic CD. Take the game as it was, but give it updated 2D graphics.

[Eviltaco64]

Never look at the clock speed of a CPU and assume that's the deciding factor. There's more than just megahertz.

The Dreamcast featured 8MB of video memory, as well as up to 6x or 10x texture compression (depending on your source). The PSP features 2MB edram for video. That's a huge bottleneck right there.

Yea, the game could be ported, especially being a first gen DC game. There could be some improvements, and there likely would be some minor drawbacks. My point is, don't assume that the clock speed is the only important factor.

As for me, I'd like to see an update to Sonic CD. Take the game as it was, but give it updated 2D graphics.

I'm sorry, when I said extra power, I was saying that it could receive a lightly scaled down port of Sonic Adventure. And looking at games that are coming out for PSP in the future (like the PSP version of God of War), I know it can be done.

Another good Sonic PSP game would be a remake/revival of Sonic Xtreme. I know this would NEVER happen, but it was an interesting game.

A Sonic CD remake wouldnt be right.
They'd have modern Sonic characters (like Rouge and Cream) come to wreck it.

A Sonic Collection would also be great.
Sonic Mega Collection + Sonic Gems Collection = Ultimate Sonic Collection.

[Medion]

I'm sorry, when I said extra power, I was saying that it could receive a lightly scaled down port of Sonic Adventure. And looking at games that are coming out for PSP in the future (like the PSP version of God of War), I know it can be done.



And that's why you'd still likely be wrong. The Dreamcast basically used obscene texture compression and a lot (by 1999 standards) of video memory to help with textures.

The PS2 and PSP use small amounts of VRAM, combined with available system memory and a fast FSB, to shuttle the textures in and out of VRAM, aka, texture swapping.

But if you took a game like MSR, for example, which actually displayed the equivalent of 40MB of uncompressed textures in a scene, then no, the game would never be possible on the PS2, much less the PSP.

Again, SA was a first gen DC game and likely could see a port on the PSP. It was ported to the GCN, and that system is also weak in the VRAM department. My point is, don't assume that, because "the psp has more megahertz", that a port of any game is a given. MSR would have been impossible on the PS2 or PSP, and it's likely not the only DC game to fall into that category.

[Eviltaco64]

And that's why you'd still likely be wrong. The Dreamcast basically used obscene texture compression and a lot (by 1999 standards) of video memory to help with textures.

The PS2 and PSP use small amounts of VRAM, combined with available system memory and a fast FSB, to shuttle the textures in and out of VRAM, aka, texture swapping.

But if you took a game like MSR, for example, which actually displayed the equivalent of 40MB of uncompressed textures in a scene, then no, the game would never be possible on the PS2, much less the PSP.

Again, SA was a first gen DC game and likely could see a port on the PSP. It was ported to the GCN, and that system is also weak in the VRAM department. My point is, don't assume that, because "the psp has more megahertz", that a port of any game is a given. MSR would have been impossible on the PS2 or PSP, and it's likely not the only DC game to fall into that category.

I never said that just because the PSP has "more megahertz" than the Dreamcast, it can handle any Dreamcast port. I meant that the PSP running at 222 MHz probably could not handle a Sonic Adventure port very well at all and that the recent unlocking of the handheld's potential could help Sega port SA with more ease.
And yes, PS2 and PSP lacked VRAM in comparison to the Dreamcast. But both have graphically superior games. You're right, Sonic Adventure couldn't be done on PSP...in the same format it was in on the Dreamcast.

And yes, Gamecube received a port of Sonic Adventure. I'm not sure if the Gamecube had less VRAM than the Dreamcast, but the port was very well done. Models were larger and had a higher polygon count, and overall everything in the game was enhanced. Did it use the same engine that the DC version of SA used? Im not sure.

Before you continue, can you tell me how much VRAM the Gamecube has?

[xg917]

sonic adventure games were awsome. if sonic rivals wasnt a racing type of game and more like the sonic games for genesis then it would be hot.

[Eviltaco64]

sonic adventure games were awsome. if sonic rivals wasnt a racing type of game and more like the sonic games for genesis then it would be hot.

Yeah, but for some reason, Sega just wants to make Sonic worse and worse as the years go by.
They made Contra 2D again, why dont they make Sonic 2D (and not the Sonic Advance/Rush style of 2D Sonic)?

[xg917]

sonic advance wasnt bad... it was like the ones for genesis. but yea i expect something like the new super mario bros for DS. how it was 3d but 2d type of levels. that gave was just awsome.

[Eviltaco64]

sonic advance wasnt bad... it was like the ones for genesis. but yea i expect something like the new super mario bros for DS. how it was 3d but 2d type of levels. that gave was just awsome.

Sonic Advance was ok, I'm just not a big fan of the Sonic Advance type of style.

A 2.5D Sonic game like New Super Mario Bros would be a good idea.

The "new" Sonic the Hedgehog :cool:

[Medion]

I never said that just because the PSP has "more megahertz" than the Dreamcast, it can handle any Dreamcast port. I meant that the PSP running at 222 MHz probably could not handle a Sonic Adventure port very well at all and that the recent unlocking of the handheld's potential could help Sega port SA with more ease.

Fair enough.


And yes, PS2 and PSP lacked VRAM in comparison to the Dreamcast. But both have graphically superior games. You're right, Sonic Adventure couldn't be done on PSP...in the same format it was in on the Dreamcast.

The PS2 overall was more powerful than the Dreamcast, but the DC still had a few tricks that the PS2 could not do. While on average the Ps2 has graphically superior games, the DC still has a few that the PS2 can't touch.

The PSP is not superior to the DC. It's like a Playstation 1.5, putting it in the same neighborhood as the DC, give or take. It's debatable which is more powerful, but neither has a clear edge.


And yes, Gamecube received a port of Sonic Adventure. I'm not sure if the Gamecube had less VRAM than the Dreamcast, but the port was very well done. Models were larger and had a higher polygon count, and overall everything in the game was enhanced. Did it use the same engine that the DC version of SA used? Im not sure.

SA on the GameCube was a direct port with no graphical enhancements. All that was thrown in were unlockables.


Before you continue, can you tell me how much VRAM the Gamecube has?

The GameCube has 1MB of memory for the frame buffer, and 1MB for texture memory. However, the GCN also featured 8x texture compression.

So, theoretical texture memory available from top to bottom, account for compression where available, is:

Dreamcast = 42MB
Gamecube = 8MB
PS2 = 3MB
PSP = 1.6MB

Again though, we have different architectures. The DC relied on a lot more memory and compression for storing textures. The PS2/PSP would store them in system memory and shuttle them in and out as needed. The GCN, with it's two-layered system memory, could do mix what the DC and PS2 did.

Like I said before though, SA is a first gen DC game, and likely didn't make much use of the DC. A stripped down port should be doable.

[Eviltaco64]

Fair enough.



The PS2 overall was more powerful than the Dreamcast, but the DC still had a few tricks that the PS2 could not do. While on average the Ps2 has graphically superior games, the DC still has a few that the PS2 can't touch.

Agreed. Didnt the PS2 hardware have to emulate Anisotropic filtering when Dreamcast and even Nintendo 64 already included it?


SA on the GameCube was a direct port with no graphical enhancements. All that was thrown in were unlockables.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qE5ZfxUHvU8&feature=related

It's not the best of quality, but you can see that the models have been enhanced/have a higher polygon count. I still prefer the DC version, though :)


Like I said before though, SA is a first gen DC game, and likely didn't make much use of the DC. A stripped down port should be doable.

That's pretty much what I said in the beginning.
With the recent unlocking of the PSP's power, it could receive a scaled down port. Then you thought I said that PSP could handle any DC game and this entire thing began :rolleyes:

[Medion]

Agreed. Didnt the PS2 hardware have to emulate Anisotropic filtering when Dreamcast and even Nintendo 64 already included it?

Pretty much. The PS2 doesn't do much in hardware, not even mip-mapping. Sony wanted a strong CPU (the EE) to do everything. Sound familair? Same original plan with the Cell in PS3.


but you can see that the models have been enhanced/have a higher polygon count. I still prefer the DC version, though

I stand corrected, and I agree with your preference :)



With the recent unlocking of the PSP's power, it could receive a scaled down port. Then you thought I said that PSP could handle any DC game and this entire thing began

I agree with you that it could handle a scaled down port. However, we'll likely never see it. Sega likes to port to better hardware, to make the porting easier. Porting to inferior hardware means you either get a crappy port, or you need to put more effort into it.

[Eviltaco64]

I agree with you that it could handle a scaled down port. However, we'll likely never see it. Sega likes to port to better hardware, to make the porting easier. Porting to inferior hardware means you either get a crappy port, or you need to put more effort into it.

Funny story. I checked how they emulated the Sonic games on Sega Genesis Collection on PSP. They used wav files instead of fully emulating the sound :rofl:

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r256/MikeGarwood93/SonicFiles.jpg

[Medion]

Funny story. I checked how they emulated the Sonic games on Sega Genesis Collection on PSP. They used wav files instead of fully emulating the sound :rofl:

You can blame Steve Snake for that. Genesis sound was thought to be "impossible" to emulate. A few of the smash packs and sega sompilations were done through his emulation.

Of course, when Sega asked him to do it, they gave him the white papers on the Genesis. He used that to make Kega Fusion, which does properly emulate the sound of the Genesis hardware :)

[Eviltaco64]

You can blame Steve Snake for that. Genesis sound was thought to be "impossible" to emulate. A few of the smash packs and sega sompilations were done through his emulation.

Of course, when Sega asked him to do it, they gave him the white papers on the Genesis. He used that to make Kega Fusion, which does properly emulate the sound of the Genesis hardware :)

Yeah, in my opinion, Kega Fusion has the most accurate 32X Sound Emulation.

Anyway back on topic.

What Sonic game do you (DCEmu) think would best suit the PSP?

[radioactivemario]

I agree with you that it could handle a scaled down port. However, we'll likely never see it. Sega likes to port to better hardware, to make the porting easier. Porting to inferior hardware means you either get a crappy port, or you need to put more effort into it.

OR!!! they could make a 2.5-D version of Sonic Adventure. think about it, Megaman ZX had a 2-D town to run around in. they could remake Station square and every other area in 2.5-D, couldn't they? instead of being lazy they could make a fresh new engine for it. (then use that to remake Sonic Adventure 2. :p)

but i would also like to see Knuckles Chaotix on the PSP.

[JLF65]

As long as this thread popped up again, I'd like to mention that the PSP has texture compression as well. Most homebrew doesn't use it, but I imagine commercial games do. In fact, most homebrew rarely tends to use anything other than 32 bit ABRG textures (which wastes the most memory).

Another point is that the PSP doesn't need as much vram as it can use textures in system memory (albeit at a reduced rate), which it has far more of than the DC.

The PSP is NOT a PSX 1.5. It's far more powerful than that... in fact, it's arguably more powerful than the PS2 (but not enough to emulate the PS2).

[ronii1123]

a sonic the hedgehog dreamcast remake would in my opinion be great on the psp

[Sonicdude1995]

would like 2 see Sonic Jam,Sonic R & Sonic Adventure 2 on the psp!

[Eviltaco64]

Well, now that this thread has popped up once more, I'm sure that Sega would never port any of the good games over to PSP. They haven't even made a variant of Unleashed for it, and that probably would've been a good experience on the PSP. :/

But thanks to emulation, we at least get to enjoy the original series. :)

[JLF65]

But thanks to emulation, we at least get to enjoy the original series. :)

Yep! Nothing better than playing Sonic/2/3/Blast/CD on PicoDrive on my PSP. It's like it was MADE for just that. :D

[Eviltaco64]

Yeah. :)

I wonder if 32X emulation would ever be possible on PSP. I wouldn't mind Chaotix either.

[pibs]

This might sound kinda lame but I thought Sonic Spinball was pretty good. It incorporated my love of pinball and sonic :)

[Eviltaco64]

This might sound kinda lame but I thought Sonic Spinball was pretty good. It incorporated my love of pinball and sonic :)

Haha, you're not alone. I still have that for my Genesis, and I never thought it sucked.

[Sonicdude1995]

a 3 in 1 pack which consists of sonic adventure 1 & 2 & sonic shuffle would be cool enough with the original dreamcast graphics!

[radioactivemario]

Hi people. Idon't make psp stuff, I don't even know what the heck all this talk about texture swapping is all about. But I was thinking; What about the PC version of Sonic Adventure DX? It has the models, textures, sounds, and even peices of the engine fully accessable.
I'm probably going to get called a moron for this, but what if someone ripped it all out, and then put it all back together in psp format? Even if you could only grab the graphics and sounds, couldn't a psp programmer write a new engine?

[0m3GA ARS3NAL]

Well, if you were a Sonic Fan since the beginning, like moi, you should get a sega emu and play the old school ones.