...ISO questions...

[Kaiser]

Please, read pinned topics like this one. You see, the staff doesn't need to explain why it's against the rules.

Don't say stupid things like this. 1time explained it fully. The resaon I reply to this statment here is so that stupid thread will die.

But you didn't at all address that discussing it alone is legal. The entire process is legal up until the online distribution. It's legal to describe backing up, modifying, and playing games. It's illegal to talk about how to make it so thousands of people can download it.

Once again, you fail to distinguish between legal backups and illegal ones. I don't WANT to discuss piracy at fine boards such as this, ISO discussion can easily be moderated to be kept clean and legal.

The point is that wraggster simply does not believe in PSP ISO discussion of any form. Its bad for the scene and for the PSP. The PSP community shouldn't look the other way and allow the legal "back-up" discussions either, because no one makes LEGAL back-ups, except for the people who want to share there those no longer legal back-ups. Not to mention wraggster should have complete control of what is discussed on his forums no matter what because its his right as owner of the site. Your arguing in plain legal talk but you keep avoiding this site's belief and the one thing that sets it apart from most of the other PSP sites.

USING PSP ISO's IS ****ING WRONG

[Cap'n 1time]

Thanks, this is nice of you. And it's only natural to leave this pinned topic open when ya don't close the 50 that ask "can I play emulators on my firmware" from people who don't read pinned topics.

Im too sick (i have a CODE! A CODE!) and tired (its like 9:00 AM here) to argue with you. I leave it open so that people will see how annoyed we are with people asking about this over and over and over again. your added arguments are actually helping because other people join in and give their point of view. But still the bottem line is WE DONT DISCUSS ISO'S OR WAREZ OF ANY KIND PERIOD.

Also no one is perfect, I think you mentioned before that warez was what killed the dream cast which is NOT TRUE. but thats somthing to take to the dreamcast section. theres people that can explain it better than I in that section.

[Heran_Bago]

The PSP community shouldn't look the other way and allow the legal "back-up" discussions either, because no one makes LEGAL back-ups, except for the people who want to share there those no longer legal back-ups.

THere are also people who want to modify games they own for personal use (legal. like putting new levels in a game you own, etc) and people who like how the PSP's battery life is about double when the console doesn't have to spin a disc.

However you've proven your point the reson is that discussion is illegal because "wraggster said so." In fact, that reason makes the most sense, and is the most mature reason anyone's tried to give so far.

I think you mentioned before that warez was what killed the dream cast which is NOT TRUE. but thats somthing to take to the dreamcast section.

I've never discussed dreamcast on this board. If you can quote me saying that "warez killed dreamcast," then I'll never argue here again. What I did do was prove you wrong when you claimed that suprnova got shut down by something outside suprnova.

Let's play the hypocracy game, shall we?
Good: Teaching people how to rip DVDs to PSP friendly video and re-encode what could be rented movie to watch on their PSP.
Bad: Teaching people how to backup & watch FFVII:AC for the PSP, even though getting movies to run on PSP is considered "hacking" by some, and "homebrew" by others.
Good: Making ways to run GBA games on the PSP, despite that the system and games are stiull in production, and that playing GBA ROMs on a PSP is the same economically and corporatly as playing PSP ISOs on a PC or other console.
Bad: Playing PSP ISOs on a PC or other console.

Still, you have the right to ban ISO discussion, because it's YOUR board, and you have the right to make yourself look rediculous.

[Kaiser]

THere are also people who want to modify games they own for personal use (legal. like putting new levels in a game you own, etc) and people who like how the PSP's battery life is about double when the console doesn't have to spin a disc.

Modifying Games for personal use is a different story entirely and its not required to post ISO files or even to talk about them. Surely someone could release a patches in the same vain as coders some times patch .bin files. I don't think any mod would have a problem with that. As for doubling battery life, well thats hardly and argument at all, and still doesn't warrent ISO discussion its simply not a big enough reason.

However you've proven your point the reson is that discussion is illegal because "wraggster said so." In fact, that reason makes the most sense, and is the most mature reason anyone's tried to give so far.

Okay, cool. We can agree on that.

Let's play the hypocracy game, shall we?
Good: Teaching people how to rip DVDs to PSP friendly video and re-encode what could be rented movie to watch on their PSP.

Thats a good point. But the likely-hood of someone ripping there own UMD is a lot lower then someone ripping there own DVD. Even after that though your argument still stands.

Bad: Teaching people how to backup & watch FFVII:AC for the PSP, even though getting movies to run on PSP is considered "hacking" by some, and "homebrew" by others.

I can agree with your call here if its true. Pure hypocracy. I never knew about this before can you please point out a link to a thread about this stuff.

Good: Making ways to run GBA games on the PSP, despite that the system and games are stiull in production, and that playing GBA ROMs on a PSP is the same economically and corporatly as playing PSP ISOs on a PC or other console.
Bad: Playing PSP ISOs on a PC or other console.

Best point you've made so far. I agree there are some conflicting rules on this site and this one is a major one that needs to be fixed. All I can say is the GBA is nearing the end of its life span.

Still, you have the right to ban ISO discussion, because it's YOUR board, and you have the right to make yourself look rediculous.

No, i don't think dcemu can/should be percieved as ridiculous.

What it comes down to if you look past the hypocracy is that dcemu has hopes of legitamizing PSP homebrew. As well as getting the not so legal fun of emulators. I think one unspoken rule is that dcemu will not teach or create methods in order to pirate games for the system they are developing for. In a way its method of unoffical supporting the system while fiddeling with software to get more fun out of it. It may sound like fence-sitting to you but not to wraggster and his closest staff.

[Cap'n 1time]

thank god for kaiser. you might not have said anything about the dc and im sorry, everything is a little blury thanks to this cold. anyway it isnt like I have all the time in the world to discuss why we dont support warez and iso discussion. that isnt even 1% of what the psp scene is all about. You can bitch about it all you want, thats what this thread is for, but the bottem line is there will be more warez and there will be no iso discussion. Im sorry if you dont find that mature, but I dont think demanding that someone elses very successful and long time running network network meet YOUR expectations of how it is run is very "mature" in the first place.

[Heran_Bago]

Modifying Games for personal use is a different story entirely and its not required to post ISO files or even to talk about them.

I made a way to change the tempot in any song in Lumines. It's pretty cool, but to do it, you need to dump and run your copy of the game. If I can't post about how people can do and experience this, why even post that it's possible?

Surely someone could release a patches in the same vain as coders some times patch .bin files. I don't think any mod would have a problem with that.

IPS patching doesn't work on ISOs, or you get huge patches that are just as big (and essentially ARE) an ISO.

I never knew about this before can you please point out a link to a thread about this stuff.

Specific thread? No. Just a lot of IRC talk and many, many programs designed to do this. PSP video 9, DVD descrambler, etc. All of these are seen as "ok" by the homebrew scene, even if the movie industry might not think so.

As well as getting the not so legal fun of emulators.

Emulation is fun? One could make the argument that piracy is fun. I choose not to because it's morally/economically wrong.

that isnt even 1% of what the psp scene is all about.

Really? Give me an example of a psp homebrew IRC channel, and if its population is 99% of of the population when you add it to a typical PSP ISO channel, I will admit that I've been immature, and will forever blindly follow the no ISO discussion rule.

[Kaiser]

Okay I've been arguing the wrong way. Since the beginning I've been arguing over the moral issues of using ISO's. Arguing this way only makes you point out what you as "hypocrisy". Arguing with you has changed the how I stand on the issue. I think I finally understand why wraggster picks and chooses whats allowed and what is not. The reasoning behind it is he encourages development on the PSP as long as it doesn't hurt the PSP scene or sales.

Fact: Emulators and homebrew for the PSP are good. They make another reason to buy the PSP and indirectly can/will help its sales.

Fact: Loaders and ISOs discussion even within the legal spectrum do in fact harm the PSP scene. Any legal discussion of it which includes modifying the game will only lead to true illegal piracy. Sure that can be kept legal but not for long as someone will exploit the openess of the discussions and it will lead to piracy.

Just because something is legal doesn't mean that its good for the system and its certainly not worth creating legal "back-ups" and "modifications" when this kills the PSP. Hell, I'm actually for modifications but when the games are still in production its not worth the risk of modifying when it can hurt the system in the form of piracy.

Emulation is fun? One could make the argument that piracy is fun. I choose not to because it's morally/economically wrong.

That wasn't really an argument. I wasn't arguing that emulation is fun and therefore all fun things should be allowed. I just said it was fun! thats it.

[Cap'n 1time]

..and will forever blindly follow the no ISO discussion rule.

well if your still too stuckup to figure it out then.. damn right youll follow it blindly. That goes for any one that feels like trolling about warez. Though Sony is an evil empire we do not steal from sony. We do not offer roms on our site and we do not support the linking of any type of illegal media. Your free to have an opinion but this is not the USA, nor is it the UK. This is Wraggsters forum and what he says is law, regardless of what your rant is. You have free speech so long as it dosnt violate the rules.

Also we have our OWN psp scene. Homebrew coding STARTED the scene and thus IT IS THE SCENE. So regardless of what you do on the ancient and mostly unmodderated IRC chatrooms, it has nothing to do with us. That isnt the scene anyways.. thats a bunch of 12 year olds that over use the letter "z" and think the world revolves around them.

[Heran_Bago]

Fact: Loaders and ISOs discussion even within the legal spectrum do in fact harm the PSP scene. Any legal discussion of it which includes modifying the game will only lead to true illegal piracy. Sure that can be kept legal but not for long as someone will exploit the openess of the discussions and it will lead to piracy.

Close. Discussion does not hurt anything. discussion can get people more interested, etc. It got me coming back to this board every couple days. However, PIRACY is the problem. Not the discussion of legal backups, not even the discussion of piracy, but the act of it. There is a big difference between doing and saying. There are visible barriers.

You make a good point that emulation helps a console out. And the PSP's not-too-amazing game library, it really needs it.

well if your still too stuckup to figure it out then.. damn right youll follow it blindly

No, I said i'll follow blindly if you can prove that piracy is 1% like you claimed.

This is Wraggsters forum and what he says is law

Ya. I said that. In fact, the only senseble reason you've given so far is "Wraggster said so." Early, I said it was the most mature reason you gave. I take it back. It's the only mature reason you've given. Up there with the "we can't tell you" reason.
You are absolutly correct. This is a board. This is a dictatorship. You can make yourself look silly, lose an argument, and still win with a baning or thread closing. You're a mod.

Homebrew coding STARTED the scene and thus IT IS THE SCENE.

I could give you counter examples from how other scenes (GBA) were only made possible in part of the efforts of pirates. But how about I let the numbers talk for today's scene:


Hits Google:
psp + ISO: 3,160,000
psp + emulation: 2,380,000
psp + homebrew: 1,520,000

The scene is what people care about. I don't think you have the right to say that only 1% cares about ISOs.

So regardless of what you do on the ancient and mostly unmodderated IRC chatrooms, it has nothing to do with us. That isnt the scene anyways.. thats a bunch of 12 year olds that over use the letter "z" and think the world revolves around them.

It is completely your right as moderator to talk like you're better. But why do you keep saying "you"? I'm not into PSP piracy, I'm into modifying games I own, which is legal. I like changing textures, in-game text, etc. I don't have to enter an IRC room to do that. I don't, even. But if we must get on the subject, I'm still waiting for you to prove to me how much bigger homebrew IRC channels are than illegal ones.

[Kaiser]

Close. Discussion does not hurt anything. discussion can get people more interested, etc. It got me coming back to this board every couple days. However, PIRACY is the problem. Not the discussion of legal backups, not even the discussion of piracy, but the act of it. There is a big difference between doing and saying. There are visible barriers.

Well your right that discussion of it is bound to lead to increased interest. Of those interested people I'd say most of them would at least attempt it. If all this discussion was allowed and the information was out there, well connect the dots, it would lead to more piracy occuring because of how easy it is. I understand what your saying about the difference between doing and saying. I'm juts saying most people won't just say "Oh, thats interesting!" and then completely forget it and not even try it.

Even though this information is easy to find at other sites anyway. I don't think dcemu should just blindly support it from peer-pressure either. Dcemu is trying to create its own scene with a responisble community who avoids the darker side of homebrew developoment.

And the PSP's not-too-amazing game library, it really needs it.

Thats for sure. I think I've spent about an an eight of my playing time with my PSP on actual commercial games.